R-22 conversion

[reefermadness]

Has anyone converted Carrier's that are on R-22 to another refrigerant? Speaking of mostly Ultra's. With the R-22 soon going out of style, just wondering what would be used. I am guessing that R-404a would have close to the same pressures?

I don't think that R-22 is banned here for another 5 years??

Any info would be great.

ReeferMadness

[Latte]

Hi Reefermadness,

Unless anything has changed we should have R22 till 2012.

Most new units now come on R404 so by the time we loose R22 the units on it will be very old.

I still remember the problems we had with Carrier when 12 was phased out. Blown t-bird compressors all over the country because the interim gas caused oil migration at low temp (Think it was 49 although bad memory)

R407 is the new gas on a/c replacing 22 but i don't know how it would get on for low temps.

New expansion valve and change comp oil to polyolester might work for R404 if the compressors can cope.

My honest opinion is that nothing concrete will happen until 2011, while 22 is still available there is no push to change thing

I dont know how old you are but if you remeber the change over from r12/R205 this only happened at the very last minute and thing 22 will go the same way

regards

Fatboy

[TONY_MF]

check the data of your load capacity and check your compressor if applicable to your desire refrigerant. get the refrigerant changeover procedure from your local compressor dealer.

[NoNickName]

Isceon MO59 and MO29 from DuPont is a drop in replacement for R22, and it a HFC.
http://refrigerants.dupont.com/Suva/en_US/pdf/k10927.pdf

[reefermadness]

Ok, i get the picture. Change the oil, drier, TXV to R-404a head and off to the races. Not hard since Carrier still mad the Ultra with R-404a. I was just wondering since I still convert a unit about once a month. This should have been over with years ago, but around here, old stuff thrives. Lots of SB II(I) MAX still on R-502, not to mention T-Birds on R-500.

Thanks for the insight,

ReeferMadness

[Latte]

Hi Reefermadness

We have a saying this side of the pond " If it aint broke don't fix it "

Over here you will still find some units on R12/R502 and while they are still running then you don't touch them. Obviously as soon as they have a gas leak or problem that requires removal of gas then you can't replace that gas and have to modify.

These old Carrier units just go on and on, i wonder how may vectors will still run when they are 20 years old

Regards

Fatboy

[S_Line]

I remeber many years ago when Fujitsu were retro fitting thier Splits using another company to charge with 407C

Basicly we had a customer who wanted 407C units ( this was about 4 years ago now) Fujistu didnt have any 407C units, so out came the R22 and in went the 407C, needless to say all the compressors failed after 13 months !
And guess who didnt want to know ? :lol:

R22, if only we had more people that took care, we would not be in the state we are now.

[duncan]

Please remember when changing to R404a the system needs to be flushed, all the sv's need to be changed, TX valve to be changed, new shaft seal, new valve plates. We did many of these in South Africa and learnt the hard way. Dont forget that there is also a quench valve on the r22 system and the R404a system doesnt have one. We did leave the valves in on our conversions.

[smoggy]

if you remove the gas from an old system to carry out some work. legally, can you put that gas back into the system when the work is complete if the gas is say r12 or r502

[Latte]

if you remove the gas from an old system to carry out some work. legally, can you put that gas back into the system when the work is complete if the gas is say r12 or r502

This is a new one on me . The trouble is normally you would be taking out the gas because you have a leak so would not have a full charge, once you put this reclaimed gas back in you would no be able to top it back up again as using fresh R12/R502 would be illegal

regards

Fayboy

[reefertech]

R 407 will be the replacement for R22 I think.

[reefertech]

R507 I meant not 407

[afeef]

hi dear
find all replacement in this link:

www.harpintl.com/guide.htm

regards
afeef

[Reeferjon]

Do we have any further thoughts on this as its getting closer......

[acnerd]

Unless anything has changed we should have R22 till 2012.

That's news to me! Your details say you're in the UK, maybe you aren't ..... they stop making R22 the end of 2009.

[acnerd]

if you remove the gas from an old system to carry out some work. legally, can you put that gas back into the system when the work is complete if the gas is say r12 or r502

I thought the only thing you can do on an R12 system was to take out the refrigerant and dispose of it. Isn't it illegal to even run R12 systems? I'm not being facetious, just thought that was the law?

[acnerd]

Do we have any further thoughts on this as its getting closer......

I was speaking to a bloke at a Climate Centre last week who said there are two replacements for R22. Drop-in replacements that is: R417a and R422d. Not that I've tried them, but it will all kick off next year.

A lot of customers think we can just change to R407c, but the oils are different, and the retrofit would be risky.

[Shibhrac]

Accordeing to monterial treaty for the phase out of refrigerant 22. It will be phased out totally by the end of year 2030

[Will]

I thought the only thing you can do on an R12 system was to take out the refrigerant and dispose of it. Isn't it illegal to even run R12 systems? I'm not being facetious, just thought that was the law?

Where did you hear this bs ?

[bruisermac]

here in canada there are still people with R12 in their car air conditioners!!!!! I have fixed man old R12 container reefers. We still sell R12 in the transport industry.

[acnerd]

Where did you hear this bs ?

Keep forgetting different laws in different countries!!

[Ration_Tea]

Here is the replace for R-22 base on National refrigerants

"R-407C, R-410A, R-417A" I don't know if every country are the same!

[ryanc]

Has anyone converted Carrier's that are on R-22 to another refrigerant? Speaking of mostly Ultra's. With the R-22 soon going out of style, just wondering what would be used. I am guessing that R-404a would have close to the same pressures?

I don't think that R-22 is banned here for another 5 years??

Any info would be great.

ReeferMadness

In Canada the replacement is R410 I know carrier uses it now but not sure about TK.

[Will]

Keep forgetting different laws in different countries!!

When it comes to R12 regulations, I thought we (USA) were the worst ?

[Boss302]

I would think if you were going from R22 to R404a you would also have to install a heat exchanger, as R22 Carriers don't run a heat exchanger.

[abbsnowman]

I'm with you Latte! You guys are creating a Frankenstein here. Have you checked for a heat exchanger like Boss said? R404 units have them. Does yours?
I would leave her alone!