Split system install costs

[dmsims]

OK no such thing as typical! but just trying to get a handle on expectations. What would you expect to pay?

Fujitsu ASYA14LG
9m pipe run (no extra charge required)
1/2 and 1/4 pipework
Good access, pipes run under floorboards/joists in cellar then up through floor and then through a stud wall to indoor unit
Gravity drains of a few metres

TIA

[monkey spanners]

I'd expect to pay nothing as i would be doing it myself....

Is the wall open on one side for access? Do the joists need notching? Is the outside wall 2ft thick stone? Is there any parking? Do you have any annoying pets? Does the outside unit need a pad or brackets? Is it a 2 mile walk from inside to outside? Is the customer likely to be a pain in the @ss during the work, likely to find niggly problems or a poor payer?

[al]

Why can't whoever supplies the unit install it? You've answered your own question, no such thing as a typical install, i charge over 2500euros to install a 2.5Kw unit....

alec

[Makeit go Right]

Best thing you could do is get an installer to come around and give a quote.

Then two more quotes, and you will have the best answer.

[mad fridgie]

Why can't whoever supplies the unit install it? You've answered your own question, no such thing as a typical install, i charge over 2500euros to install a 2.5Kw unit....

alec

F*** Me, in NZ about half that price for 4Kw a well branded inverter unit installed, wired, 5 year parts and labour warranty

[r.bartlett]

F*** Me, in NZ about half that price for 4Kw a well branded inverter unit installed, wired, 5 year parts and labour warranty

Direct price comparisions between countires are not valid. Try the Big Mac index for that.
http://www.bigmacindex.org/2011-big-mac-index.html

However I did once get asked to ball park a job in NI and I was cheaper than the locals even after allowing for travelling expenses. :-)

fyi
3 or 5 years parts on the system (1 yr on ancillaries) and 1 year labour warranty is std here..

[r.bartlett]

Best thing you could do is get an installer to come around and give a quote.

Then two more quotes, and you will have the best answer.

He has been in contact with Charlie P and arranged for him to visit or so I thought.

[dmsims]

Thanks for all the replies. I do understand the difficulties of estimating sight unseen

Is the wall open on one side for access?
Yes
Do the joists need notching?
No
Is the outside wall 2ft thick stone?
Yes but you won't need to drill it
Is there any parking?
Yes
Do you have any annoying pets?
Only a lovely Labrador
Does the outside unit need a pad or brackets?
Pad already there
Is it a 2 mile walk from inside to outside?
No a few steps
Is the customer likely to be a pain in the @ss during the work, likely to find niggly problems or a poor payer?
No - a fair price for a fair job - we make excellent bacon buttties

I have had one quote

No contact from Charlie

[sinewave]

F me Al, 2500 euros for installing a 2.5kW split?

There's contractors round our way wapping 2.5kW splits in for £895 + VAT including the equipment!


Is there no competion in Ireland or is the work in the 'Bad lands'?

[dmsims]

Hmm I would like to see the justification for 2500 Euros

Materials and sundries for a 15m run are are what £100-£200 ?

[install monkey]

bacon butties sounds like bribery,and a labrador isnt lovely when its sniffing ur nuts and trying to hump ur leg, but it sounds easy enough-pity ive got a tracker and live over 200 mile away.

[al]

Sine, there's guys here installing for that price too!! dmsims, the point i'm trying to make to you is that this isn't a forum to check your prices, do as others have suggested and get a few quotes, or are you trying to limit what your installer is charging? What industry are you in yourself? I'm not having a go at you but i'm well fed up with people (generally uninformed) telling me what i should charge.....the market dictates that, you have no idea what materials cost here (we ceased to be part of the commonwealth in 1922) or what overheads etc are here.....

alec

[COBRAKAI]

Price Materials.. Price Labor add together add ten percent for extra measure. issue quote.

[mikeref]

bacon butties sounds like bribery,and a labrador isnt lovely when its sniffing ur nuts and trying to hump ur leg, but it sounds easy enough-pity ive got a tracker and live over 200 mile away.

What's the problem with dog owners these days? They Know i'll be at their place soon yet the owner still lets them roam free to pee on my tyres, constantly sniff at my ass, chew my tool bag and take off with one of my boots!! Note: it is polite to leave boots at the door when entering someone's house.

[dmsims]

I had already arranged for 2 quotes before asking the question here. The reason for asking is to get a very rough idea of indicative costs having already done some research on material costs.

Would it be correct to say that a domestic split install would take 1-2 days as an average ?

[dmsims]

Sine, there's guys here installing for that price too!! dmsims, the point i'm trying to make to you is that this isn't a forum to check your prices, do as others have suggested and get a few quotes, or are you trying to limit what your installer is charging? What industry are you in yourself? I'm not having a go at you but i'm well fed up with people (generally uninformed) telling me what i should charge.....the market dictates that, you have no idea what materials cost here (we ceased to be part of the commonwealth in 1922) or what overheads etc are here.....
alec

Sorry (I couldn't see anything in the rules about not checking prices)

Already arranged quotes - just wanted to check that they are in the same ball park

I work in IT on large scale network and server projects

If materials are that expensive get them shipped over - it costs less than £50 to ship 50kg from the UK

[mad fridgie]

I had already arranged for 2 quotes before asking the question here. The reason for asking is to get a very rough idea of indicative costs having already done some research on material costs.

Would it be correct to say that a domestic split install would take 1-2 days as an average ?

Not having a dig, just abit of fun, you are in IT, yes. I need a new mainframe, looked at the material cost, a bit of plastic $5, some sand from beach "Freebie", 0.5kg of copper $10, a bit of solder, $1 and some odds and sod $10, I am in the ballpark.
of course not, it is expertise/overhead behind it is where the cost lies.
Our Irish counterparts, maybe perfectionist, gluing the insulation, painting the insulation, clipping every foot, with thermal broken brackets. Triple evacution (new oil in the vac pump every time), 24hour nitrogen pressure test. Wash the van every day, for a smart image, making good the penetrations with amatching product, plus there maybe a shyte load of compliance paperwork.
This is the quality of work i do when installing a domestic AC unit. NOT, I would never get a job if i did

[r.bartlett]

Let's not have a race to the bottom on this one

[Makeit go Right]

I had one domestic customer doing all this in-dept investigation of our price, after we had given him many ideas on how to install his conservatory system, how to hide the pipework and condenser etc. He was trying to understand how my price was made up, wanting a labour price and materials price etc etc etc. Had a cheaper price but wanted to use us, and finally wanting to use my engineers directly for a "finders fee".

He said this was the kind of thing he would do at work for a large contractor (I'll bet he does).

I told him that the other price was a good price and he should go with them. Funny thing was he still wanted to use us but I had to push him away, kind of thing. That chap would have been all over the engineer, adding another day to the job and then doing a pricing activity afterwards to query the price........ go away mate!

And this one sounds awfully like that.

[dmsims]

The computer analogy is a poor one especially WRT to a mainframe. Do you have a huge R&D department, clean room manufacturing facilities, custom hardware development and manufacture, software development writing millions of lines of code, QA and testing etc. A mainframe is a little bit more than the cost of some raw materials.

I have now had 2 quotes which are variant by over 60% - the more expensive quoted for the wrong pipe sizes and a connection for the condenser to the consumer unit ? I will be leaving the engineer alone - that's what I am paying him for apart from a cup of tea (did I mention bacon butties)

No one likes being charged over the odds - how many of you buy materials at B&Q?

[mad fridgie]

The computer analogy is a poor one especially WRT to a mainframe. Do you have a huge R&D department, clean room manufacturing facilities, custom hardware development and manufacture, software development writing millions of lines of code, QA and testing etc. A mainframe is a little bit more than the cost of some raw materials.

I have now had 2 quotes which are variant by over 60% - the more expensive quoted for the wrong pipe sizes and a connection for the condenser to the consumer unit ? I will be leaving the engineer alone - that's what I am paying him for apart from a cup of tea (did I mention bacon butties)

No one likes being charged over the odds - how many of you buy materials at B&Q?

You missed the point, it not the cost of raw materials, but the cost behind the materials.

I look at microsoft, IBM, apple, facebook, google, whos really being over charged.

[TRASH101]

You are really missing the point dmsims,

If you want an analogy that is closer to your mark consider this

You have an empty server room,

You need to get yourself a few racks of servers in and a couple of core switches some patch panels etc...

So who do you use for

a) Your hardware (including racks and fan trays etc....)
b) Your cable infrastructure (structured and beautiful or an explosion in a wire wool factory)
c) Who is going to commission and honour the warranties?
d) Is any of them going to offer a cost breakdown to the far end of a fart?
e) It all still needs connecting to your ups/gen set or whatever.

and lest we forget

You'll need some aircon in there too

When you have considered those issues then Mads point must surely be accepted?

I can't blame you for wanting to have all the information laid out in front of you so that you can try to ensure the you get the best deal for your cash, but don't be surprised when you are criticised for the approach you have adopted when addressing some of the most helpful and respectful, professional, people you'll find anywhere.

[Makeit go Right]

"No one likes being charged over the odds - how many of you buy materials at B&Q?"

Er, none of us buy our materials from B&Q.

Fair enough for you to ask questions and seek advice but please do not start taking the mickey too.

Aircon engineers possibly buy a screw driver, hammer, or toolbag from B&Q but that DIY-shop does not sell aircon materials. The thing is, this work is not plumbing. It can look a bit similar to the untrained eye, and we have heard stories of plumbers using B&Q pipework, and even the odd story of a plumber filling the system with water. It is hard to believe but gives us all a smile (LOL).

Aircon systems involve specialised gas pipework systems that run at very high pressures -- enough to kill -- and B&Q does not deal with them kinds of materials. Aircon engineers use particular suppliers to source the special tools, plant and materials (incl the high pressure copper pipework) needed, and that all costs a bomb or two, which adds into the price you see. And then there's the costs of all this year's extra (UK) training+assessment, time off work to do all that, and business registration etc.... that overhead has to spread itself over some quotations too.

And bacon butties don't really enter into the pricing calculations.

[dmsims]

Thanks for your reply, I appreciated most of your points already and maybe B&Q was a poor choice. Certainly not my intention to take the mickey but just look at the price of say 4 core electrical cable from the sheds!

I realise it's a specialist job and as in all walks of life price and competency are not always correlated.

[charlie patt]

i did get jo in the office to replie to your email, we are in paignton all this week if you would like us to pop around please call many thanks charlie

[monkey spanners]

Why not work out the price you would be happy paying and then ask if people can install a system for that price?

If they can you will have your system at a price you are happy paying and if they can't then you either undervalue the work required and costs involved or its just not that important you have air con that you will have it at what it costs.

Simples

[al]

Nice one Monkey!!

alec

[dmsims]

I will do if you help answer the original question LOL

Seriously though I had no idea what the range would be not having much idea of what is involved - a OMB who has just started will undercut the competition or do you go for a larger company with all the associated overheads.

I am happy to pay hundreds but I would not be happy to pay four figures

Why not work out the price you would be happy paying and then ask if people can install a system for that price?

If they can you will have your system at a price you are happy paying and if they can't then you either undervalue the work required and costs involved or its just not that important you have air con that you will have it at what it costs.

Simples

[al]

A OMB may not be around too long if they keep undercutting, do you have independent warranty on the Fujitsu unit? Will you also ensure your installer is F-Gas certified etc? This all costs as stated above, it has to be covered somehow.

alec

[dmsims]

al

Yes warranty confirmed with Fujitsu. Yes F-Gas is a requirement from me.

[Makeit go Right]

You should also ensure that the electrical is installed in accordance with Part-P of the Building Regulations, a legal requirement.

Many fridge engineers are not qualified to do the power supply themselves and have to sub it to a qualled electrician, or exclude it.

[dmsims]

Do you have to be qualified to do the power supply?

Are you saying that this work is notifiable ?