HFC and HC Refrigerants

[noor.sddqui]

1)are heavier than air;
2)displace air,
3)collect in chest coolers, basements & trenches etc.
4)do not smell
5)do not support life
6)One may suffocate if breathing in high concentrations of HFCs
7)Ventilate to disperse

Please help for these properties belongs to HFC or HC refrigerants,

[Rob White]

1)are heavier than air;
2)displace air,
3)collect in chest coolers, basements & trenches etc.
4)do not smell
5)do not support life
6)One may suffocate if breathing in high concentrations of HFCs
7)Ventilate to disperse

Please help for these properties belongs to HFC or HC refrigerants,

I'm not quite sure what you are asking for help with?
You have made seven statements and they are all correct as I see it.

The only thing you don't state is HC's are also flammable so may burn
if in the correct concentrations, mixed in air.

Reword your statement and ask what you want to know about them.

Just remember, all gasses other than oxygen displace oxygen, so
utmost care is required when working with all gasses, including Nitrogen (OFN)
because if we have a concentration of those gasses they will replace oxygen.

Regards

Rob

.

[noor.sddqui]

Sir
Although HC and HFC refrigerants have different properties so I am a little bit confused that these properties are of HC or HFC refrigerants

[Rob White]

.

HC Hydrocarbons are flamable, they are Propane R290, Butane (Isobutane) R600 (R600a)
and Propene R1270 to list a few and they are all heavier than air and they all have properties
that are suitable for their application.

R290 Propane is good for commercial freezers and large chillers.
R600a Isobutane is a domestic refrigerator refrigerant.
R1270 Propene is good for commercial fridges and freezers.

To list a few.

HFC hydrofluorocarbons are man made synthetic refrigerants that
can be used for similar applications as the HC ones listed above.

Refrigerants can be used for different applications and a google search
will do you as much good as here.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hydrofluorocarbons&oq=hydroflou&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0l5.9120j0j8&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8#q=HC+refrigerants

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hydrofluorocarbons&oq=hydroflou&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0l5.9120j0j8&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8#q=HFC+refrigerants

Regards

Rob

.

[noor.sddqui]

126601266112662
Dear Sir This Slide was provided to me in Hidecore training in India,but I am confused that theseproperties of refrigerant is of HC whereas they had stated it relation with HFC which is wrong.Please clarify.
Thanks
Noor

.

HC Hydrocarbons are flamable, they are Propane R290, Butane (Isobutane) R600 (R600a)
and Propene R1270 to list a few and they are all heavier than air and they all have properties
that are suitable for their application.

R290 Propane is good for commercial freezers and large chillers.
R600a Isobutane is a domestic refrigerator refrigerant.
R1270 Propene is good for commercial fridges and freezers.

To list a few.

HFC hydrofluorocarbons are man made synthetic refrigerants that
can be used for similar applications as the HC ones listed above.

Refrigerants can be used for different applications and a google search
will do you as much good as here.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hydrofluorocarbons&oq=hydroflou&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0l5.9120j0j8&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8#q=HC+refrigerants

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hydrofluorocarbons&oq=hydroflou&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0l5.9120j0j8&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8#q=HFC+refrigerants

Regards

Rob

.

[Rob White]

.

Those three slides for the most part are accurate except the last slide
with the flammability limits. I'm not sure where those limits came from
but what they are saying is that if you mix R134a exactly right in air
and then heat it up above a certain temperature and then lower the
pressure it will burn.

I bet if I had enough time and money I could prove water will burn, given
the correct conditions.

There are not that many places on the World where you have 0.4 bar pressure,
a 60% - 40% mix in air and a temperature above 177degC. You would have to
create those conditions in a lab or stand on the top of Mount Everest
(I don't even think there is much air up there?).


From a safety data sheet.

See http://www.refrigerants.com/msds/r134a.pdf

FIRE FIGHTING MEASURES.
FLAMMABLE PROPERTIES.
FLASH POINT: Gas, not applicable per DOT regulations.
FLASH POINT METHOD: Not applicable.
AUTOIGNITION TEMPERATURE: >750°C
UPPER FLAME LIMIT (volume % in air): None*.
LOWER FLAME LIMIT (volume % in air): None*.
*Based on ASHRAE Standard 34 with match ignition.
FLAME PROPAGATION RATE (solids): Not applicable.
OSHA FLAMMABILITY CLASS: Not applicable.
EXTINGUISHING MEDIA:
Use any standard agent – choose the one most appropriate for
type of surrounding fire (material itself is not flammable).

UNUSUAL FIRE AND EXPLOSION HAZARDS:
R-134A is not flammable at ambient temperatures and atmospheric pressure.
However, this material will become combustible when mixed with air under
pressure and exposed to strong ignition sources. Contact with certain reactive
metals may result in formation of explosive or exothermic reactions under specific
conditions (e.g. very high temperatures and/or appropriate pressures).


So given the right conditions and high enough temperatures it will burn but
it is NOT Flammable under normal conditions.

You can make anything burn if you heat it high enough and give it the correct
conditions. Do not worry about R134a, it will not burn under normal conditions.

Rob

.