Optimization of the refrigeration plants operation

[sterl]

OK, I'll ring in.

End Users reach a certain scale where they don't have expertise but every man presnet thinks his job is valuable...So he gives up taking any investigation or chances himself, and hires an expert to tell the boss what he wants to hear.

I hope I'm the first expert hired. Cause telling the boss after he spent the money that he wasted it only makes him mad..It don't make me any form of hero.

And thats whats wrong with the optimizing business.

[US Iceman]

... telling the boss after he spent the money that he wasted it only makes him mad..It don't make me any form of hero.

Yeah, it's a perception & trust problem.

No one likes to be perceived as the bearer of bad news, especially the guy who had the idea.

And it's difficult to gain someone's trust especially the guy who holds the purse strings for the money.

Telling someone the idea did not provide the anticipated results after the money is spent is not a way to gain trust or for them to have a healthy perception of you.

Going into a job after a project has fizzled is a mine field of emotions. More than anything, one of the primary concerns with optimization is for the level of understanding to be elevated so that the owner understand the benefits and how they are achieved. If they understand what you are proposing and the reasons for it it is easier to explain how you anticipate accomplishing the tasks.

[rooboy]

Gday Guys

Can't remember if I have posted before, but I have been reading this forum for some time. I have to say, I am impressed with the answers given to many questions. Some really cluey blokes on here. I have used this forum as a resource on a number of occasions.

Yeah, it's a perception & trust problem.

No one likes to be perceived as the bearer of bad news, especially the guy who had the idea.

This thread has been interesting reading. Optimisation has been a big part of my work over the past few months and I couldn't agree more US Iceman. Perception and trust.

I think that part of the problem is that most end users do not understand enough about refrigeration to have the confidence to decide if an energy saving change to the system is worthwhile. Too much reaction of ' don't change anything, then it won't break down'.

However it would seem that we are in for some big challenges with the advent of the carbon trading scheme etc. Our focus in the past ( feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here) has been more about performance and reliability than energy consumption. I think that a lot of our old ' rules of thumb' are about to go out the window.

Is anyone here finding end users pushing for energy audits or optimisation requirements as yet ?

Really interested to know, as I am predicting this will be bigger than our change from the faithfull three ( R12,
22,502).

Cheers

[US Iceman]

However it would seem that we are in for some big challenges with the advent of the carbon trading scheme etc. Our focus in the past ( feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here) has been more about performance and reliability than energy consumption. I think that a lot of our old ' rules of thumb' are about to go out the window.

This might be a fun topic, if you want to start a new thread. I have been thinking about this also...

What I'm afraid of if this cap & trade legislation gets passed into law is the number of experts who will suddenly appear to provide optimization services.

[Segei]

Gday Guys

Can't remember if I have posted before, but I have been reading this forum for some time. I have to say, I am impressed with the answers given to many questions. Some really cluey blokes on here. I have used this forum as a resource on a number of occasions.






This thread has been interesting reading. Optimisation has been a big part of my work over the past few months and I couldn't agree more US Iceman. Perception and trust.

I think that part of the problem is that most end users do not understand enough about refrigeration to have the confidence to decide if an energy saving change to the system is worthwhile. Too much reaction of ' don't change anything, then it won't break down'.

However it would seem that we are in for some big challenges with the advent of the carbon trading scheme etc. Our focus in the past ( feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here) has been more about performance and reliability than energy consumption. I think that a lot of our old ' rules of thumb' are about to go out the window.

Is anyone here finding end users pushing for energy audits or optimisation requirements as yet ?

Really interested to know, as I am predicting this will be bigger than our change from the faithfull three ( R12,
22,502).

Cheers

As I mentioned early, I think that many end users are closed to new approaches in energy savings. Many of them believed that nothing can be improved unless huge capital investment. This is wrong. Some of them claim that they had a consultant but he said that plant is fine. As you mentioned Rooboy, that energy savings is new direction in refrigeration and I think that not so many people can do it right. Find the right consultant. Ask questions. Test your plant.
Regarding to the adjustments. I think these adjustments should be done step by step. Small step won't hurt the plant. If any concerns, reset it back ask somebody how to resolve the issue.

[Segei]

OK, I'll ring in.

End Users reach a certain scale where they don't have expertise but every man presnet thinks his job is valuable...So he gives up taking any investigation or chances himself, and hires an expert to tell the boss what he wants to hear.

I hope I'm the first expert hired. Cause telling the boss after he spent the money that he wasted it only makes him mad..It don't make me any form of hero.

And thats whats wrong with the optimizing business.

If you can improve efficiency of the plant, you can claim that this is result of investment as well as input from consultant. Optimization of refrigeration plant operation can save energy without any investment. To please the boss, energy savings can be shared between investments and consultant. Everybody will be happy. One example. I know that one cold storage have spent $100,000 on sophisticated PLC. However, almost no energy savings have been achieved, because they didn't change set points. A consultant helped them to optimize set points and $50,000 were saved. He can claim that savings were possible, becuase of sophisticated PLC.