Canada shortage Refr techs.

[Peter_1]

What about shortage of refr. techs in Canada?
Is there a shortage and if so, do some provinces have a bigger shortage then the others?
A client/friend of me will move (not a Refr tech) to New Brunswick June next year. Paperwork is almost finished.

[rbartlett]

peter

although we have a few canadians here try this link too

http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/forumdispla...d=7&daysprune=

and ask there

cheers

richard

[frank]

I followed the link Richard posted and found this

ryan_the_furnace_guy
Professional Member

Registered: Oct 2005
Posts: 568

WOW - can this guy post

[rbartlett]

yes certainly puts marc to shame..

cheers

richard

[Krups]

haha u guys give me some jokes =)))

[botrous]

Registered: Oct 2005
Posts: 568

Is he racing ? or trying to enter the genis book . . .. ...

[Peter_1]

Still no answer from RE-members.

[botrous]

I have a relative living there and he says that there is a shortage in the HVACR industry . . . but i can't take that as good opinion because he isn't a specialist in any field of hvacr

[zerodegreec]

I can only speak of my area, Alberta. And the shortage is starting to get larger. Its not really a shortage of Apprentice or helpers, its a shortage of Journeyman due to the growth in the industry. The trade here has its ups and downs and we are in a big up swing. The growth in the oil patch up north is big and in the major cities we just don't have the experienced mechanics to keep up with the construction going on. HVAC side is busy as well due to the growth and prosperity of our province. I personally think that the Refrigeration side will taper off soon in the construction side due to the number of stores being built in the last few years and the renos, I think that by this time next year the construction of new stores will fall down to the normal levels. We do need more experienced service mechanics around here although, It takes a long time to produce a "good" supermarket guy as compared to a HVAC mechanic.

To sum it up, Alberta and BC are both in need of skilled trades. The run up to the 2010 Olympics in Vancover is going to be a HUGE drain on the available work force. Alberta offers second to none training for our industry and is going to expand the training from one center to two in the next few years from what I understand.

If you cant find work around here, you're not looking, you're not willing or you're not any good.

[JimmyMurphy]

I am also from Alberta and currently there is such a shortage of Alberta that yesterday my boss got a call to go and work in a town 5 hours north of Edmonton. They offered $95cdn/hr and $150 a day in living expenses for all refrigeration mechanics / helpers. I am a third year apprentice and the refrigeration certification in Alberta is of the highest in the world. When Salt lake city held the olympics they had Refrigeration mechanics from Edmonton fly down and set it up for them. HVAC mechanics can find a job anywhere in Canada anytime. As time goes by the trade shortage in Canada will only worsen forcing our wages through the roof!

[frank]

the refrigeration certification in Alberta is of the highest in the world.

I'm sure that there are those in AUSTRALIA that would like to differ

Reading the posts on the subject of trying to get work in Australia I think we may have to start a Poll

[Temprite]

Seems like there are posters from all countries that think that there training is the best.

I personally dont know and dont care which is the best.

Training just gives you the licience to perform the work.

Hands on experience will teach you more than any amount of training.

[JimmyMurphy]

I agree. How long does it usually take to become certified in Australia? I know in the USA you can get your refrigeration ticket from home lol which doesnt say much. not to me anyways

[Peter_1]

What qualification(s) do you need when working in Canada and how do you obtain these?
Do you need different qualifications for the different provinces?
Can a USA qualification immediately be converted to a Canadian one?

[Temprite]

In Australia you do a 4 year apprenticeship, with three years of schooling.

You also are required to have a restricted electrical licence which allows you to disconnect and reconnect, along with a licence to handle ozone depleting substances.These are also done whilst completing the apprenticeship.

Although I am sure there are some operating without the said requirements.

[JimmyMurphy]

Canada also has a 4 year apprenticeship with 4 years of schooling. We are allowed to work on anything from the disconnect-->forward. As for gas we can work on anything under 400,000 BTUs that has a Coil on it, from the Gas shut off--->forward.

USA qualifications are not recognized in Canada and as for working across the country. An "InterProvincial" ticket must be obtained. I am under the impression that if coming from a Country already certified that all you would have to do is pass the IP (InterProvincial) exam and you will be certified but Im just guessing, i will look into it tommarow and get a for sure answer.

[The MG Pony]

BC wins, We do 6 1/2 months hands on plus schooling for entry; then five year Apprentice with class room work to get the full thing for the full HVAC it is much much harder, that is JUST for Commercial refrigeration.

And yes Big shortage in Vancouver and in BC, so come now and get a good deal while the shortage lasts.

In this way you get schooling with hands on experience, and you do actual work rather then just read a book, so when you come out you have real life practical experience and a thorough understanding of the dynamics.

[AMARNATH JHA]

Hi peter

I am refrigeration engineer working in India.can I get a jod in canada.If yes,let me know the process

Thanks
AMARNATH JHA

[Jambo]

I was amazed at the amount of building work that was going on in vancouver when i was out there last year. literally a building site on every street corner.. The uncle i was visiting was a Site manager on a high rise apartment block and he was saying that he was finding it hard to find contractors to install the air con.

Id love to work out there, its such a great place.

One thing i did notice was that the most common type of condenser on split systems was the dustbin style ones and all seem to be fairly old, so come the olympics im sure a lot of businesses would be looking to get new systems meaning more work for us install guys!

[wambat]

I agree. How long does it usually take to become certified in Australia? I know in the USA you can get your refrigeration ticket from home lol which doesnt say much. not to me anyways

You may want to look at these web sites and say again that the United States is not recognized in Canada

http://www.hvacr-training.com/atrain.htm
http://www.ua.org/links.asp

[TopMechanic]

Just this past week I heard there is a shortage of furnace guys in Florida too, this is a funny business man , you never can tell.

[Shakey]

If they are paying $95 cdn/hr I am on my way!!

[Peter_1]

95 C$, I should go for much less.

[Josip]

I will go for less too , but why to complain

Some links, contacts......

Best regards, Josip

[Andy W]

How much would they pay for 30 years experience I wonder?

[Peter_1]

What's a normal pay in Canada for someone with 10 to 15 years experience in a demanding province like AB or BC?
ZerodegreeC gave me once an estimate.

[zerodegreec]

Current rate is 34.95 +Benifits Union.

I dont know where the Aprenti got the $95/hour figure. I have NEVER heard of this. The union contract is up for renewal as of April (in negotiations now) we will hopefully be up around the $40/hr +benifits. But the housing is starting to boom in a big way. Where I live outside Calgary the house sold next to me in one day for $450,000. In just under 3 years they have seen a $200,000 + profit....... WOW its getting into the stupid range. Guys in our trade cant afford to buy a house in this town anymore. We need the raise for sure. But this economy is reaching the bubble point. Its either going to implode and people will loose everything, or will start to decline any time now.

[Rob S]

I think its the same issue all over North America and with in many trades. More and more young people want to land some kind of computer job.
All the Service Managers I've talked to over the past two years have told me... "The standard take home before taxes and minus benies is probably going to be around 50+hr. With in the next 5-10yrs."

BTW.. there isn't a company in Washington state that isn't looking for "good" service techs.
I feel your pain..

[Sledge]

In Toronto the problem has been at that point for a long time. We used to enjoy a great standard of living, but in the 27 years I have been working, I have seen an erosion of lifestyle. In order to have the same lifestyle today that a skilled person could enjoy 27 years ago, it would require you to work 2 fulltime skilled jobs.

MY experience in the HVAC/Refrig business is that there is a huge shortage of capable people. Stress the word capable, not licensed, we have tried to solve the shortage of skills by licensing everything in sight.

The apprenticeship in Canada is 9000 working hours. An apprenticeship involves a schooling component, which in Ontario is satisfied by attending full time classes for 3 sessions of 2 months each session.

When I started a person was only allowed to credit 40 hours per week, and any hours above that were not credited against the apprenticeship. This forced an apprenticeship to be at least 225 weeks.

In an attempt to meet the shortage of skilled people the requirements have been loosened allowing a person to credit every hour worked, significantly shortening the apprenticeship time. They have also started to credit hours based on work experience in related jobs, or hours because of formal education, sometimes in unrelated fields. The result has been that some technicians become licensed with ridiculously short apprenticeships.

The requirements in terms of licensing to work:
-Anything over 5 tons you are required to be a licensed refrigeration mechanic (9000 hrs+exam)
-Anything over 3 tons you are required to be a licensed brazer ($5500 course+annual test)
-Handling/purchasing refrigerants requires ODP license, renewed every 2 years. You must keep an ongoing up to date accurate record of every pound of refrigerant that you buy, and where you installed it. This is subject to inspection and verification, and the inspector charges you $175/hr to check your records, including visiting the jobsite of any customer to inspect. Improper records can involve jail time, and fines- I think it is $25,000 max for first offence.
-Gas fired equipment requires a gas fitter license, rated based on firing rate of equipment(top license requires3-4 years exp, and $4000 of education)
-Electrical controls within the unit are covered by Refrigeration mechanic license, but if the unit is not a manufactured package then controls above 30v require an electricians license (9000 hrs +exam)
-Ammonia equipment requires a refrigeration operators license classified based on hp (up to 3 yrs+multiple exams)
-Hydronic heating must be installed by a licensed plumber (9000 hrs +exam) but can be serviced by licensed gas fitter
-Steam heating can be serviced by licensed gas fitter but must be installed by steam fitter or plumber

The industry in the Toronto area has a significant unionized component. The wages are approx $40/hr plus benefits. This sets the pace for the rest of the industry, which is in the $30/hr range.

If you can get into the union, you will enjoy the best wages, but usually will not get the steadiest of work. Most of the union work is for the big union contractors. They get most of their work from the big multinational companies. This means customers where the work is mainly changing countless filters-apprentice work.
The union is very political, and the system is name hiring, which means that if you are liked by the union administration then you will get the best jobs.

The cost of the cheapest shack of a house in the Toronto area would be approx $200,000 Canadian dollars

[kiwireeferman]

Seems as though you need a permit to wipe your a**e. I thought it was getting bad in New Zealand.

[The MG Pony]

You do! then you need a training course and cert to flush the toilet and a disposal liscance for use of the sewer.

[Andy]

Hi Guys,

what happens if you just work away without the certs

Also if you have enough points to enter the country surely they will allow you to work.

I have heard that companies can only sponsor you if no one in Canada has that particular skill sett and that you write the job advert for your experience.

Alsdo if you bring money in or start a business that adds to you points.

Anybody know

Kind Regards Andy

[The MG Pony]

just come here on vacation and stay, they won't notice till 20 years and only if you let them know!

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/faq/immigrating-1.html It is actualy fairly easy compared to the rest of the world to immigrate to Canada, I'm trying to get to Nz be damned if I can find any real help here inside canada on it though <_<

[Peter_1]

MGPony, Why you want to leave Canada for NZ?
I can give you many reasons why I want to come to your country and why not to NZ and I've done a lot of research on this.
But perhaps I've missed or forgotten something.

[The MG Pony]

The infamous "The grass is greener on the other side"

Well more exact I have a friend there and if we pool our resources we can achieve both our major goals in life much shorter then other wise possible. Plus our government punishes every one els for others idiocy! Moron street races and kills him self no I have to go through 2 years be for I can get a drivers licence, and so much more.

But other then that BC is a very nice clean place, I just hope it stays way, but greed is doing its part in destroying the nature here via over development.

[Andy]

just come here on vacation and stay, they won't notice till 20 years and only if you let them know!

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/faq/immigrating-1.html It is actualy fairly easy compared to the rest of the world to immigrate to Canada, I'm trying to get to Nz be damned if I can find any real help here inside canada on it though <_<

I was in Toronto 6 years ago, should have just stayed, I have dual nationality and could have went back in as Irish if I was kicked out as British

One of my regrets in life


Kind Regards Andy

[bernard]

Hi

My Brother works in Canada and I spent some time there when I was in the forces.What a great country well thats what I thought until I did an asbestos course and was told they are still using asbestos and do not agree with the dangers assosiated with it.

Regards Bernard

[The MG Pony]

Asbestos is universally baned here? In fact multiple buildings have been shut down for them to remove all of it some flat out condemned. Here in BC at least.

[floyd57]

I to reside in Alberta. There is absolutley a shortage of as stated above good Mechanics because employers are willing to take any and everyone on for a least a shot at the trade. The only problem with Alberta and BC as upposed to the other Provinces is the cost of living. Used to be fair but due to the boom In Alberta inflation has been ridiculous. Houses that were selling for 160,000.00 about 5 years ago are selling for 500,000.00 to 600,000.00. Which is blasfamy.You may make more money *note the wage stated above* but cost of living will bring you right back down to the ground. Not to mention the time spent driving (sitting) in traffic.
I would suggest other provinces which are always in need of good Mechanics such as Manitoba or Saskatchewan, Wages are practicaly the same and cost of living is considerably lower.Talking to a buddy the other day Winnipeg average cost of house is running 160,000.00 to 190,000.00 which is great for this day and age in Canada.

Oh,Canada!

[Richard Hillsid]

I am also from Alberta and currently there is such a shortage of Alberta that yesterday my boss got a call to go and work in a town 5 hours north of Edmonton. They offered $95cdn/hr and $150 a day in living expenses for all refrigeration mechanics / helpers. I am a third year apprentice and the refrigeration certification in Alberta is of the highest in the world. When Salt lake city held the olympics they had Refrigeration mechanics from Edmonton fly down and set it up for them. HVAC mechanics can find a job anywhere in Canada anytime. As time goes by the trade shortage in Canada will only worsen forcing our wages through the roof!

Gee, at 95 Canadian a hour, I’ll relocate, how hard is it to get a work permit with a US passport, I’m US expat for -> forever. Full Cold and Electric licenses for EU.