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Thread: Aluminium or Copper?
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13-02-2012, 06:59 PM #51
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
Good decision tony, sorry I cant attend, 4500 km away.
I am sure there will be enough curious techs here.
And for all of you who are seriously want to learn about new technology, please, PM Tony with all your details.
Best of luck Tony.
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19-02-2012, 07:26 PM #52
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
just had a sample of the alloy sent down, what is this new chemical film on it it looks exactly like thick wall alloy to me want to try it and read all the leaflets but still worried about the corrioson when lagged or in a wet enviroment //
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20-02-2012, 10:07 AM #53
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
Charlie,
There is no chemical film? - aluminium has very low corrosion rates compared to steel or copper. This is due to the protecting oxide layer that forms on the surface when exposed to the environment
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20-02-2012, 09:00 PM #54
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
so what have i read wrong i thougt there was a new protective layer/ if its just like standard alloy in 5 years time it will need to be replaced / as far as natural reaction with air to provide a protective seal i cant agree only today cut out 4mm wall alloy tube of a 4 year old deck, pourous as hell now yes we get this in copper but not at 4 mm thick unless its a reevap coil what am i missing here tony
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23-02-2012, 09:33 AM #55
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
Charlie,
Find my website - send me an email - I will then have your email address to which I can send all the relevant data - which will hopefully answer all your questions?
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29-02-2012, 08:33 PM #56
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
Well I am dissapointed to see that no one after all of the negative comments is open to attend an event where they could actually see and then criticise on our product - poor show really
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29-02-2012, 09:00 PM #57
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
When and where? If its reasonably local and i'm not called away on a breakdown or site visit i'd come and have a look or, are you going to have a stand at the ACR show next month?
http://www.acrshow.co.uk/
Many may see your product as reinventing the wheel, we already have pipe thats easy to use and join and has a proven track record.
I'm not overly bothered by the price, every system needs pipe so its a level playing field at the moment.
Its a bit like when hauliers complain about the price of diesel, when the real problem is people undercutting to get work which cheaper products won't change.
In your products case, what it could do is mean i make LESS money, if the jobs i'm quoting against have been price cut by others to use cheaper materials that i may chose not to. Or i end up using it and still only making the same as the price per install goes down.
Time will tellMostly found in Oxfordshire, UK :)
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29-02-2012, 09:33 PM #58
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
if the scrap value increased more than £4.20 a kilo( current copper prices in the north) then youd be shifting more of it, and if there are any flaws/problems then no doubt youd get feedback. as monkeyspanners mentioned -inventing the wheel,also the term teaching monkeys new tricks springs to mind-good luck
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01-03-2012, 07:43 PM #59
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
the biggest problem i believe is we where being told its a new product but all the questions i have asked have not been answered i got a sample sent down AND IS STANDARD ALLOY and i personally would not trust it not to have problems when wrapped in armaflex with pitting, the other problem tony is as fridge engineers we work big hrs and if we are going to get bits of the wholesalers and you are there doing a demo then fine we will listen of course there must be a bacon sandwhich involved. we are all willing to try new items but we have been down this road before with alloys and that was before 410 was being used. copper is running out we realise that and we are not just sticking our heads in the sand if we can make a cost saveing and have good product its a done deal but we just dont trust it/ a 3 year warrantie is great but when its hidden in behind a wall is it enough/ i have no idea what warrantie copper comes with but excludeing a builders nail or bad workmanship i have not had a copper coil or half hard leak we get pourous re evap coils but after several years in harsh conditions our industry does move on such as digital controllers/ invertors eevs etc etc but we as engineers need a decent product at a decent price and be as reliable as poss to keep the customer in 5 years time there are plenty of trade shows and i have offered to test a set of coils as its comeing out in december so we could inspect it? but no answer if you dont like the answer tony dont ask the questions
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04-03-2012, 12:45 AM #60
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
All very well showing how to join it up but what is needed is some sensible explanation about the differing coefficients of expansion.
I still can't get my head round how these two different metals with VERY different coefficients of expansion fused together somehow, one tight against the other ...... ie one metal expands faster/further than the other, as they both warm up/cool. How does that work if the two metals are joined tight together? Something has to give if one metal wants to expand more than the other. These can be massive forces.
Copper: Coefficient of expansion: 9.8 (microinch/(in oF))
Aluminium: Coefficient of expansion: 13.1
3years is no good, either. You need to be sure the pipes will outlast the system, say 15-20years or so.
The last thing you want is to hear of systems blowing up under stress... lost gas, damaged kit..... after you have put in 3-4 years of them installs. If the pipework is not fit, there will be no hiding place for the installer.
So, explain how these two very differently expanding metals can co exist in a single pipe, please, without one separating from the other.
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06-03-2012, 02:17 PM #61
Re: Aluminium or Copper?
MakeIt Go Right
The product you are indicated is not ours - eco is a product that is only aluminium - to the others - Yes I will be at the ACR show but not exhibiting, however if you want to speak with me at the show - I am open to that and maybe we can address your concerns. - For all of you - I was and maybe considered by some to be an engineer -