Carrying stock

[Mick13]

A post in another thread got me thinking....

All u guys that work for companies with 5-10+ technicians, do u guys carry stock? not PCB components necessarily, but contactors, capacitors, relays, stuff like that.... the company i work for wont allow us to carry stock, everything we buy has to be charged, and they feel its all good if we need to drive 2 hours to get a $30 capacitor because we can charge the client for it, then return to site and find after fitting the new part that there is something else wrong like the compressor is also seized and the compressor now needs replacement, and then give the client a $500 bill for diagnosis, where if we had the part in stock it would have been covered by the initial one hour service call fee....

I think its a great way to piss off customers, and it has led me to buy my own stock of basic capacitors, contactors etc, if not to fix on the spot but to at least be able to diagnose correctly.

how many times have u found a faulty contactor that was caused by a dead compressor? it happens, i personally do not enjoy quoting for repairs and doing the work, then finding something else majorly wrong with the system, for this reason i carry a bunch of second hand contactors, capacitors etc that i have pulled out of old decomissioned units so it doesnt really matter if i blow them up. to me thats a better option than giving a customer a $600 quote for repairs, doing the work then following up with another $3000 quote for further works.

what do u guys think?

[mikeref]

That has been going on since JC was a boy. It keeps the wheels turning. I was against wasting time right from the start and for the past 17 years, i've carried as much as possible to job sites. When going out of town, toss everything else in the back. 6 hour round trip recently and all for a start cap.

[cadwaladr]

i keep stock dont do too much a/c but my customers would go ape if i said oh will have to order parts then charge them an arm and a leg for the extra but with refrigeration in my opinion being more critical than some a/c guess it does depends on the variants you work on but the basics relays etc should be carried at least to make it run then go back to finalise and carrying too much stock is not efficient cash flow wise a happy medium is best,my biggest bug bare is fan belts on transport units you could carry lots and still be caught out.

[chemi-cool]

Its always a problem what to stock on the van. I keep records of all my regular clients so I know what I need when I have a call from one of them. New clients might have a higher cost in the first time.

[paul_h]

The companies I worked for never kept van stock either. At the most like chemicool said, they'd let you book some spares out for a known customer that might be far away, but you had to give it back if unused.

The not having stock just means you have to have more test equipment, like a megger, a capacitor tester with high range, know how to bridge out soft starters, test diode bridges, wire DOL (hopefully the sparkie has fitted an isolator next to the unit!), and all sorts of field tricks to make it hopefully a successful diagnostics.
But yeah, it sucks and is a rip off and a time waster having nothing, even with all the tricks and tools, you still can't do anything repairs and it may be a while to get parts, or even may mean you have to come back the next day or even longer.
Not even having a spare capacitor, relay, transformer, small common fan motors, fuses and thermal fuses for fridges used to really bug me.

[install monkey]

if you do carry stock in your van then usually it gets smashed or crushed when a gas bottle tips over or if it survives then theyre can be problems with warranty too as the part in ur van could be 2yr old and if it fails in 10mth the customer is quick to produce the report sheet from 10mth ago,i carry contactors,fuses,condensate pump,steel work fixings,and gas,nitrogen,general fixings-anything shiny is kept in the shed for recycling

[Mick13]

The companies I worked for never kept van stock either. At the most like chemicool said, they'd let you book some spares out for a known customer that might be far away, but you had to give it back if unused.

The not having stock just means you have to have more test equipment, like a megger, a capacitor tester with high range, know how to bridge out soft starters, test diode bridges, wire DOL (hopefully the sparkie has fitted an isolator next to the unit!), and all sorts of field tricks to make it hopefully a successful diagnostics.
But yeah, it sucks and is a rip off and a time waster having nothing, even with all the tricks and tools, you still can't do anything repairs and it may be a while to get parts, or even may mean you have to come back the next day or even longer.
Not even having a spare capacitor, relay, transformer, small common fan motors, fuses and thermal fuses for fridges used to really bug me.

thats true, but personally im not the biggest fan of hard wiring a big compressor directly to test it because the contactor is burnt out, especially if there isnt an isolator in a safe spot!

and if u have got a single phase PSC compressor with a blown cap, theres no way to check the comp isnt seized without replacing the cap.

But you are absolutely right, it means u need to be more diligent to prevent wrong diagnosis.

[Gideon Beddows]

you should carry a contactor and a relay and so on, but if you need any outdoor unit spares, just look on the roof of the shopping centre you are working on? Hundreds of units just bursting with stock? Help yourself?

[stufus]

Having established a good relationship with the main suppliers when I was working for myself .I came to a rolling stock agreement for the more common consumables and would draw down a stock for the van at the start of every month (or as required)and as the stock was used I would ring it in and it would be booked out and billed,
No longer self employed and the company I work for don't approve of van stocking
But the suppliers still allow me to stock up and ring it in with purchase order numbers as required.
Have had to travel to their place a few times due to me having something on board that they needed back ,But that goes with the territory.
Always keep a "GO TO BOX" in the van if you have room ,parts from de-com units are always handy to have .
Some of the manufacturers trading directly over hear allow you to keep spare's on active request if you know the right people...I.E. if you deal more with a particular brand and know the usual suspects in term's of parts you can get them to hold x amount of these in your name (££limit),Which obviously reduces lead time on replacements and keep's customers sweet.
But all in all the best tool any of us own is our brain ,diagnose once ,repair once (most of the time)

Cheers
Stu

[paul_h]

thats true, but personally im not the biggest fan of hard wiring a big compressor directly to test it because the contactor is burnt out, especially if there isnt an isolator in a safe spot!

and if u have got a single phase PSC compressor with a blown cap, theres no way to check the comp isnt seized without replacing the cap.

But you are absolutely right, it means u need to be more diligent to prevent wrong diagnosis.

Yeah i used to hoard stuff, like old capacitors and contactors pulled from decommisioned units.
Even went to the point of desoldering stuff from dead PCBs - receivers, varistors etc (that's how I got into PCB repairs in the first place).
Thorough testing (with equipment I had to buy myself to make it possible), is still even a great time waster when I could pull out some test parts if I had a gut feeling about what the faulty part was based on experience. Like you mentioned, say capacitor is faulty, has the owner left it like that switched on for weeks, long enough to possible cause the compressor to be seized? My test equipment will only show capacitor failure or winding short, you need a capacitor to test with.

Way before I left these jobs I started bringing in my own reclaimer, vac pump and ext ladder, and of course universal remote controller. edit: also my Annie, how many techs have one of them for small recips?

Anyway it was pretty dire working for someone else...
That's why I said "stuff it, I'm working for myself".
It's not just the overheads that make the independent guys much cheaper than the larger companies, it's also the inefficient time wasting that larger companies do, making employees driving around to suppliers half the day and coming back out to sites later (any trying to charge that time to customers), that make them way more expensive.
Not to mention the greater chance of misdiagnosis because they don't have a fair few simple test parts supplied to get the job done quicker and less time wastage stuffing around with half guesses which have to be double and tripled checked to make sure they haven't got it wrong. If they get it wrong, then the larger company with no spares in stock just says "too bad, sorry, you got to pay us for our time anyway", which loses hem future customers

[install monkey]

stu in ur box do you have a cu250h1spp compressor suitable for a 407c system around 28kw rated and 3 phase-me neither haha

Having established a good relationship with the main suppliers when I was working for myself .I came to a rolling stock agreement for the more common consumables and would draw down a stock for the van at the start of every month (or as required)and as the stock was used I would ring it in and it would be booked out and billed,
No longer self employed and the company I work for don't approve of van stocking
But the suppliers still allow me to stock up and ring it in with purchase order numbers as required.
Have had to travel to their place a few times due to me having something on board that they needed back ,But that goes with the territory.
Always keep a "GO TO BOX" in the van if you have room ,parts from de-com units are always handy to have .
Some of the manufacturers trading directly over hear allow you to keep spare's on active request if you know the right people...I.E. if you deal more with a particular brand and know the usual suspects in term's of parts you can get them to hold x amount of these in your name (££limit),Which obviously reduces lead time on replacements and keep's customers sweet.
But all in all the best tool any of us own is our brain ,diagnose once ,repair once (most of the time)

Cheers
Stu

[mikeref]

if you do carry stock in your van then usually it gets smashed or crushed when a gas bottle tips over or if it survives then theyre can be problems with warranty too as the part in ur van could be 2yr old and if it fails in 10mth the customer is quick to produce the report sheet from 10mth ago,i carry contactors,fuses,condensate pump,steel work fixings,and gas,nitrogen,general fixings-anything shiny is kept in the shed for recycling

Yeah, the crush syndrome is a bit of a drama and so is carring parts for months on end however, i'd rather take my chances. There is only an electrical wholesaler in town but they don't carry any refrigeration gear. Always phone orders and then waiting for the couriers to deliver. Not good enough when supplies are needed now.
I won't carry any compressors though... do you know of any good suppliers of 3 phase R22/407c hermetics? Next day delivery with written 12 months warranty... in english?

[stufus]

No but I know a bloke with an Identical one in his van ,just the oil needs tipping and changing, but the lazy barsteward won't do it,he want's a warranty or some other sh1t .
Cheers
Stu

stu in ur box do you have a cu250h1spp compressor suitable for a 407c system around 28kw rated and 3 phase-me neither haha

[install monkey]

ive got the serial number of the 1 i sent back,so i will know if sanyo tony will have retrofitted it haha

No but I know a bloke with an Identical one in his van ,just the oil needs tipping and changing, but the lazy barsteward won't do it,he want's a warranty or some other sh1t .
Cheers
Stu

[stufus]

I'll give him a call and tell him to change the serial number so . Just to be sure
Cheers
Stu

[install monkey]

even if its a brand new un tampered-i bet its been kicked round the warehouse! haha

I'll give him a call and tell him to change the serial number so . Just to be sure
Cheers
Stu

[stufus]

Take your pick HAHA!!!!

[assailant]

..like the actron ducted unit i went to between christmas and new year that failed on christmas day..

soft starter blown (what a surprise) and compressor run cap dead. bypassed soft starter by installing a second hand contactor to get the unit going while parts are sent from sydney..
turns out the contactor is faulty :@
fortunately i also had a brand new contactor with me but that will now be second hand.. then more time spent swapping contactors over.. all time and materials that cant be charged for in the warranty call.

all part of the value the customer receives when they buy from a company who installs and services the equipment.

[r.bartlett]

you should carry a contactor and a relay and so on, but if you need any outdoor unit spares, just look on the roof of the shopping centre you are working on? Hundreds of units just bursting with stock? Help yourself?

I heard of a dashingly handsome chap who drove 80 miles but forgot to take the R22 with him. Turns out one of the old units for the shop next door now seems to be running SOG....

[install monkey]

it wasnt me as i chase parked buses!! - i have been known to borrow the odd v belt,pcb,lennox controller

[al]

You're just helping rid the world of R22 RB, we should look upon it as helping the planet

al

[Magoo]

Back to the original poster, obviously you work for a tight fisted boss, you can carry the basics from redundent equipment which is very good of you to support the client.
I generally use one hour couriers from supply co's. And do some thing else productive in the wait time, like have lunch and drink loads of clients coffee. The client will never usually challenge parts costs, but will be very picky with site labour costs and travelling time, I beleive that bigger service cos have a floating runner that will pick up and deliver parts as required to CBD site. Very sensible idea I think.

[Mick13]

What is with actron units and the soft starters failing....

in my experience actron are very reliable units, except for the units in the last few years that seem to have a bad batch of soft starters!!

..like the actron ducted unit i went to between christmas and new year that failed on christmas day..

soft starter blown (what a surprise) and compressor run cap dead. bypassed soft starter by installing a second hand contactor to get the unit going while parts are sent from sydney..
turns out the contactor is faulty :@
fortunately i also had a brand new contactor with me but that will now be second hand.. then more time spent swapping contactors over.. all time and materials that cant be charged for in the warranty call.

all part of the value the customer receives when they buy from a company who installs and services the equipment.

[Makeit go Right]

Spare parts in the van..... I feel the engineers should always have 2-3 different condensate pumps, as these are frequent faults. Appreciate the warranty issue if the pump is in the van for 3months, but if replacing them as they are installed, that should not be a problem.

Carrying contactors and capacitors etc (salvaged maybe) shows up a star from the regular engineers. That gets you the exact problem and if you like you can buy the correct one knowing it is going the wrap the repair. Buying a spare part and then still not running, however logical makes everyone look stupid.

[scottishladx]

The only stock I carry is my ice machine cleaner

[install monkey]

went to a walk in fridge- found defrost timer sticking-had to give it a kick and shorten the defrost duration until i go back with a micro rex £20 timeclock,only has an eliwell 901 so can only extend the diff!!
if only i didnt carry,gas,nitrogen,condensate hose,driers,contactors,leak spray,glosticks,steel fixings,fuses,crimps,condensate pumps,cable,spurs,core bits and various fixings,manuals haha

[Makeit go Right]

When my customers question the prices, I take them to look in my engineer's van and explain about carrying all them tools, plant, kit and spares etc in the expensive diesel van. Plus everything else And then it all makes more sense to them.

[rude]

It is impossible to carry every single spare part. But i generally scavange stuff off old units like capacitors etc. But i dont carry around spare fan belts and site specific stuff like that.

Also the reason why companys don't want "van stock" is because it all has to be counted at stock take and its to hard.

[mikeref]

Tell me about it.. Then when all stock has been removed from under the seats as well i find i have 10 of the same item. So thats where my sunnies went along with enough change to buy another carton of beer.