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  1. #1
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    Boiling H20 freezes



    Here's a link to a video of water in an Vacuum chamber boiling then freezing

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Par-jcV2tPc
    Last edited by chillerman2006; 10-09-2011 at 05:11 AM. Reason: Peter_1 - corrected me


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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    is this what happens when you pull a vacume to quickly ? as i remember being told something like this but i seem to have a gap in my memory as to who and when

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by simon@parker View Post
    is this what happens when you pull a vacume to quickly ? as i remember being told something like this but i seem to have a gap in my memory as to who and when
    Yeah, thats it mate

    Its the reason behind a triple vac

    When you pull a vacuum it will vapourise water untill it has used up the available heat/energy & then the water just freezes
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Mmmm, nice video Chillerman, where did you filmed this or get it?
    It's better to keep your mouth shut and give the impression that you're stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter_1 View Post
    Mmmm, nice video Chillerman, where did you filmed this or get it?
    Had it so long now mate - can't remember where it came from
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Well, in fact, I made this video ;-) And it is not in an environmental chamber but in a vacuum chamber. There are some pictures of this chamber on RE
    It's better to keep your mouth shut and give the impression that you're stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter_1 View Post
    Well, in fact, I made this video ;-) And it is not in an environmental chamber but in a vacuum chamber. There are some pictures of this chamber on RE
    OOH ! I hope your not gonna have me for copyright, Boss

    Good job I did not try to tell you porkies (lies)
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Hi
    every apprentice should veiw this video.

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Amazing. Thanks to the OP & Peter... If you have more such useful videos, I'd love to see them.
    Engineering Specialist - Cuprobraze, Nocolok, CD Technology
    Rarefied Technologies ( SE Asia )

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    I'm a 2nd year apprentice and i think that was a brilliant video...but if water freezes during the vac will that not just leave ice/water/moisture in the pipe?

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by newbie View Post
    I'm a 2nd year apprentice and i think that was a brilliant video...but if water freezes during the vac will that not just leave ice/water/moisture in the pipe?
    You are right and not right. This bottle was placed in vacuum chamber where the vacuum process is going very, very fast with huge pumps. Imagine the pumps stored in a place as big as a small house for a chamber of +/- 2 x2 m (space filled with pumps stacked and with the chamber is +/- 10 x 15 m) Then the achived vacuum is something we only can dream of..they'"re working on a molecular level of vacuum, UHV (ultra High Vacuum). UHV is in the range of 10 (-79) Pa or 140 (-9) torr. Some systems uses additional molecular vacuum pumps to speed up the process. Price: < 25,000 €/pump and there are sometimes 8 pumps on a chamber.
    The vacuum process is going that fast that the needed energy to vaporize isn't going fast enough through the plastic of the bottle with freezing as a result. The energy is faster removed then it is added.
    What we better had done was continuing the process and we should have seen sublimation of the ice. But the operator of this machine can't afford long standstills of his machine.

    We almost bought one 2 years ago at Philips Brussels where we should have use it to freezedry documents after water damages of inventories. This is a very nice application of this chambers.
    It's better to keep your mouth shut and give the impression that you're stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.

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  13. #13
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    RB - do we get an explanation then
    Last edited by chillerman2006; 14-08-2011 at 03:52 PM.
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by chillerman2006 View Post
    RB - do we get an explanation then
    No can do as I wasn't there...

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Well not 100% & running the risk here of becoming Peter's signature

    We have 3 gaseous base elements here 2 in the water and 1 with the introduction of nitrogen

    along with any refrigerant that may or may not be present

    Whilst pulling a vacuum oil is also often removed

    The frozen substance is a mixture of H20+N (or maybe refrigerant) + oil

    caused by pulling a vacuum too quickly & the hygroscopic feature of the oil in use

    I have been informed that using the larger vac pumps on smaller systems is an issue

    No experience of this though as I do not normally work on them

    do not have mr o'brien 's email to hand or that copy of service engineer

    can anyone confirm ?
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    @Peter_1....so eventually the vacuum would evaporate the ice?

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by chillerman2006 View Post
    Well not 100% & running the risk here of becoming Peter's signature

    We have 3 gaseous base elements here 2 in the water and 1 with the introduction of nitrogen

    along with any refrigerant that may or may not be present

    Whilst pulling a vacuum oil is also often removed

    The frozen substance is a mixture of H20+N (or maybe refrigerant) + oil

    caused by pulling a vacuum too quickly & the hygroscopic feature of the oil in use

    I have been informed that using the larger vac pumps on smaller systems is an issue

    No experience of this though as I do not normally work on them

    do not have mr o'brien 's email to hand or that copy of service engineer

    can anyone confirm ?
    http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=378742

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by r.bartlett View Post
    cheers, I'll have a butchers after dinner
    Last edited by chillerman2006; 14-08-2011 at 09:22 PM.
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    hey

    can not log in to that site + do not wish to join

    i am expecting the old argument of nitrogen does not help evac - just pushes out oxy

    the answer we need though is exactly what is the substance in the video

    better to tell us than post a link no-one can view surely

    Last edited by chillerman2006; 14-08-2011 at 09:22 PM.
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by chillerman2006 View Post
    hey ricky

    can not log in to that site + do not wish to join

    i am expecting the old argument of nitrogen does not help evac - just pushes out oxy

    the answer we need though is exactly what is the substance in the video

    better to tell us than post a link no-one can view surely

    As I say I wasn't there as this was well after I left fridgetech so I haven't got a clue..

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by r.bartlett View Post
    As I say I wasn't there as this was well after I left fridgetech so I haven't got a clue..
    Get out of it - if you worked with Marc you must do, surely

    You make me jealous of any training you got there now!
    Last edited by chillerman2006; 14-08-2011 at 09:52 PM.
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    If we look at his fingers, it seems that the only residue is oil. I would suspect that there is refrigerant trapped into a water/oil mix (solid), when heat is added the refrigerant just boils out of the mix (similar to the reason you have a crankcase heater)

  23. #23
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Thanks Mad

    much appreciated
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    It also makes a pingy noise as it goes round the bends in the pipework....
    Mostly found in Oxfordshire, UK :)

  25. #25
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by monkey spanners View Post
    It also makes a pingy noise as it goes round the bends in the pipework....
    Interesting - I have a cone I use for listening to bearings & now pipework, yeah makes sense
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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by chillerman2006 View Post
    OOH ! I hope your not gonna have me for copyright, Boss

    Good job I did not try to tell you porkies (lies)
    Classic!! Honesty is always the best policy. I've always liked the saying, what goes around, comes around.
    To the optimist, the glass is half full. To the pessimist, the glass is half empty.

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    Re: Boiling H20 freezes

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeref View Post
    Classic!! Honesty is always the best policy. I've always liked the saying, what goes around, comes around.
    Yep, I like to be up front & honest with people

    & when I read back through the posts, I think Peter tactfully give me just enough rope to hang myself
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