No Body have An Answer !!!

**Mahmoud** · 14-09-2005, 10:46 AM

I've posted this but didnt get an answer guys ..

A blast freezer @ Room temp. of -40*C, the evaporator if selected based on the capacity @ Evaporating temp. of -46*C it would for example 12 KW, so if am gonna select the blast cooler according to this capacity with a delta T of 6, the size of the evaporator would be very silly and small, the thing am doing that i consider the capacity @ Evaporating temp. of -35 which will be 20 KW, by this way i have a logical size of the cooler and it works efficiently and the temperature is reached, but i still wonder if i can select a smaller (Economical) evaporator lets say @-40*C with a capacity of 15 KW, and why, and what is the rule and limits??!!

**Servicefrigo** · 15-09-2005, 06:10 AM

I thinck you don't show here enough details about it .I'm sure somebody will give you a right answer,if you do so.
Regards

**Lc_shi** · 15-09-2005, 08:48 AM

Maybe your question is with question-

I think you select refrigeration system for cold storage based on:
1) storage room temp ;
2) cooling load calculation;
3) select blast freezer --the evap temp vs room temp delta T can choose from 4.5 to 10K which depends on your humidity control request

hope to know much of your question.

rgds
LC

**botrous** · 15-09-2005, 10:07 PM

Hi Mahmoud how are you doing ? I bet you are very polite yourself just to say hello when entering a forum for the first time , as for my english the mates can understand what i'm saying . . . .

GUYS i gonna be a little rude and impolite and publish a private message I received from Mahmoud

This is the copy paste message as it is , just copy paste

hey botros, teach your self up how to be a gentleman, and fix your english (those something).... 4 the god sakes .. botuous is the name !! stay away teacher..

So what do you think guys , I'm impolite , that message was sent because of my reply to the threat linked here for reference
http://www.refrigeration-engineer.co...ead.php?t=3081

Considering that this was Mahmoud's first post in the forum , this can be verified by searching the posts by Mahmoud from older to newer (simple forum option and glad it exists)

Peter for the name that Mahmoud can't spell well sorry for his language , Mahmoud my real name is Pierre = Peter = Botrous so if you can't define a name don't bother yourself by trying to spell it .. . Peter I think our names are outdated , why don't we try to change it.

And Mahmoud , why you are getting no answers ? because you should salute the people before expecting replies.

I have an idea , why not making a poll on how we feel when someone asks for something before saluting and if we feel that really we want to reply. Another Idea

a poll to see who thinks i'm polite enough to be among you guys or i'm not and you are just supporting me by politness.

Boss and administrators please forgive me for beeing nastyyy to publish this post in 2 threats so who should read can read . . .

Mahmoud please don't misunderstand my post , I welcome you from my part

**Abe** · 15-09-2005, 10:23 PM

Boutros

Im with you
The guy needs a "lesson"
On net etiquette and respect for fellow members

Im glad you brought it up

**botrous** · 15-09-2005, 10:29 PM

Thanks Aiyub . . . finally i decided to bring it up and become a little bit nasty

**Peter_1** · 15-09-2005, 10:32 PM

Mahmoud, what's wrong with a teacher, with an name?
What's wrong with not speaking the Englisch perfect?

Can you speak Dutch, French, German, Chinese, Russin,...?

Don't forget that peoples from all over the world are visiting this forum, so we have here a code - which we are very pride of - you have to respect.
You otherwise have to visit alt.hvac where you can shout as much as you like. But not here.
Do the test yourselves, post once your question on their site. You will receive much different answers.

You visited this forum with a problem, a question - I don't say it was a stupid one but evaporating on -35°C in a room of -40°C ??? - so you want to be teached.
Apparently you're missing something.
d' Accord?

And I shared the comments of Botrous completely on you first posts? Your entry was rude, unpolite and this may be said.
These are for me standard values, etiquette rules (not net-etiquette rules or the rules of this forum) but general rules of good behavior.
Reason also why this forum is still growing and spreaded it's wings now all over the world because we all try to keep it the way it's goin now for many years.

Mahmoud, I had a technical answer for you but i'll keep it now for myselves.
Be economical and hang your evaporator of 12 kW, you will see what happen. Don't forget to put heaters in it and charge it perhaps with some oil.

Mahmoud, sorry for the bad English, the grammatical errors, the spelling mistakes, the wrong typing but if you want' it 100 %perfect, then I will have to say it in my own mother-tongue.

**botrous** · 15-09-2005, 10:37 PM

I like the "''

'dAccord?

Peter , your french accent is great

**Peter_1** · 15-09-2005, 10:44 PM

Sorry Botrous, ca doit êter d'Accord au lieu de 'd acorrd, the accent was on the wrong side.
C'est depuis l'école - maintenant plus de 20 anneés - que j'ai parlé le Francais et ca reste toujours difficile pour moi.
Je comprend beaucoup en Français mais pour le parler et surtout l'écriver??
Ca me ne jamais interessé à l'école et je regrette ça beaucoup.
Mais, ce n'est pas trop tard.
Saluut Peter.

**botrous** · 15-09-2005, 10:52 PM

Eh bien Peter , ton Français semble parfait pour 20 ans . . . je croix qu'il y a un peu de rouille dans la partie de ta mémoire qui s'occupe de cette langue , un peu d'huile et ça marche de nouveau comme un engrenage roullié un peu de lubrification et il tourne parfaitement de nouveau

Maybe your last post is the first "goutte" of oil

A propos du "d'Accord" tu as raison , c'est une faute de frappe , je ne suis pas parfaitement encore habitué au clavier de mon nouveau portable

**chillin out** · 15-09-2005, 11:07 PM

Botrous, Im with you. If you hadn`t of said it 1st either I or somebody else would have said it.

I also posted this in both threads because we ARE mates and I will always back you up.
Both you and peter1 are probebly not the best at speaking perfect english but you are polite and genuine people whom are liked thought this forum.

Another Idea a poll to see who thinks i'm polite enough to be among you guys or i'm not and you are just supporting me by politness.

As far as im concerned you are respected active member of this family.

**botrous** · 15-09-2005, 11:13 PM

Thanks for the compliment Chillin . . .

I'm not asking you to always back me up , just do it when you think I'm right , when you think I'm wrong try to direct me to the right way

And thanks again for participating in my poll about my politness , i guess i've scored a point .

Best Regards

**chillin out** · 15-09-2005, 11:23 PM

http://www.refrigeration-engineer.co...7144#post27144

i have before and I will again .lol

**botrous** · 15-09-2005, 11:28 PM

Thanks again Chillin out . . . . . . that's why freinds are made for

**Mahmoud** · 17-09-2005, 11:44 AM

Dear Peter,,

oh god how much am surprised to open the website after 2 days to find such wars replies, comments, supports and things i cannot describe, what is this a battle field ?!!, the last one i thought he'll have such position is you !! i dont want to go through it again but it was as simple as it is, i had a technical question, i wrote it, no body answered its ok, but i dont accept to read such words for whose trying to tach me politeness in such words of botrous, if u considered that impolite asking without saying hi to others its your right, but you didnt say to me or send it at least in a private message, the only one who did is botrous whose trying to be different, then he was copying and pasting here and there ,, and somebody is thanking him here , and other one is supporting him there,, is this a war ?!! i've asked my question pure technically, things are exaggerated here and i dont know 4 the god sakes how much time ppl are spending time just to comment this issue, i feel my self silly talking about this, it is like am chatting on mirc or messenger and act like a teenager coz what happened doesnt need that much of wars, and it seems that botrous succeeded with the marketing of this meaningless issue, peter if you are talking about the standards i believe in them with the same level u r. and sending a private message to botrous was not to spoil the site with those who break the standards like botrous coz his first accent wasnt within the level of the standards that u've mentioned.. and i can reply him in the way he should be replied but i prefer keep the words 4 my self instead of going silly more and more coz i think we should be more of an open minded adults to go through i said and he said coz we all know who behave like this, peter i hope that u'll get my point..

regarding my question peter, i want to clarify one point, i will not get -45 room temp. from -35 evaporating.. and who said so ?!! i mentioned that the room temp. is -45 and we do the selection based on the capacity of the -35 evaporating which is giving more capacity than -45 from the compressor data sheet to make the cooler bigger enough from that point not to get -45 from -35 evaporating :

http://www.ecopeland.com/prodcat.cfm...ref=1&prod=426

i know exactly what am talking about peter, and am surprised to have that ironic reply from your side, coz i believe that u r open-minded and professional to meet the demands and questions, i swear by god am surprised !!, peter am not new to refrigeration, a 12 KW cooler peter ..!! u dont know me peter , so u cannot judge me, and for the answer i dont need it peter, am sorry to say so, but it is really seems that it is not a friendly environment here .. u personally made that sure... i swear by god i've entered your site after i have received happy birthday from your site so i remembered to enter here again and ask that question which was in my mind. not saying hi to anybody even mandatory but it is not a crime 4 the god sakes.. to have all this miss here..

and regarding botrous i think my private msg 4 him is enough, he was the only one reply with such words (read it again peter plz), again i think that msg is enough, i prefer being away of such silly and childy conversation .. u said and he said...

Peter am sure u'll understand what i tried to say, i have no problem personally with you, if there is, tell me so i dont have to be in this environment, nothing deserves to stand such wars..

Regards peter..

**Mahmoud** · 17-09-2005, 11:49 AM

Dear Peter,,

oh god how much am surprised to open the website after 2 days to find such wars replies, comments, supports and things i cannot describe, what is this a battle field ?!!, the last one i thought he'll have such position is you !! i dont want to go through it again but it was as simple as it is, i had a technical question, i wrote it, no body answered its ok, but i dont accept to read such words for whose trying to tach me politeness in such words of botrous, if u considered that impolite asking without saying hi to others its your right, but you didnt say to me or send it at least in a private message, the only one who did is botrous whose trying to be different, then he was copying and pasting here and there ,, and somebody is thanking him here , and other one is supporting him there,, is this a war ?!! i've asked my question pure technically, things are exaggerated here and i dont know 4 the god sakes how much time ppl are spending time just to comment this issue, i feel my self silly talking about this, it is like am chatting on mirc or messenger and act like a teenager coz what happened doesnt need that much of wars, and it seems that botrous succeeded with the marketing of this meaningless issue, peter if you are talking about the standards i believe in them with the same level u r. and sending a private message to botrous was not to spoil the site with those who break the standards like botrous coz his first accent wasnt within the level of the standards that u've mentioned.. and i can reply him in the way he should be replied but i prefer keep the words 4 my self instead of going silly more and more coz i think we should be more of an open minded adults to go through i said and he said coz we all know who behave like this, peter i hope that u'll get my point..

regarding my question peter, i want to clarify one point, i will not get -45 room temp. from -35 evaporating.. and who said so ?!! i mentioned that the room temp. is -45 and we do the selection based on the capacity of the -35 evaporating which is giving more capacity than -45 from the compressor data sheet to make the cooler bigger enough from that point not to get -45 from -35 evaporating :

http://www.ecopeland.com/prodcat.cfm...ref=1&prod=426

i know exactly what am talking about peter, and am surprised to have that ironic reply from your side, coz i believe that u r open-minded and professional to meet the demands and questions, i swear by god am surprised !!, peter am not new to refrigeration, a 12 KW cooler peter ..!! u dont know me peter , so u cannot judge me, and for the answer i dont need it peter, am sorry to say so, but it is really seems that it is not a friendly environment here .. u personally made that sure... i swear by god i've entered your site after i have received happy birthday from your site so i remembered to enter here again and ask that question which was in my mind. not saying hi to anybody even mandatory but it is not a crime 4 the god sakes.. to have all this miss here..

and regarding botrous i think my private msg 4 him is enough, he was the only one reply with such words (read it again peter plz), again i think that msg is enough, i prefer being away of such silly and childy conversation .. u said and he said...

Peter am sure u'll understand what i tried to say, i have no problem personally with you, if there is, tell me so i dont have to be in this environment, nothing deserves to stand such wars..

Regards peter..

**Mahmoud** · 17-09-2005, 12:06 PM

Hi LC,,

the blast freezer is @ -40 and the design load is 12 KW @ -46 evap. so the condensing unit selected is the Copeland 25 HP 2-Stage, humidity is the problem LC, the issue is the evaporator, if we selected the blast cooler, to give 12 KW, the cooler will be so small, coz as u know as much as you go down with the evap. temp. the capacity descreses.

if we selected the cooler at the capacity of 12 KW @ -46 evap. temp. that will lead you to a 2 fans Friga-Bohn NQ blast cooler, but if the the selection (Capacity Wise) is selected @ the point of -35 so it is 19.6 KW and the size of the cooler will be a 6 fans Friga-Bohn Blast Cooler, rhe model is NQ-8416 S with two 25 HP Condensing units, i hope that u know the friga-bohn model

, my question .. if lets say selected the cooler smaller a little bit (i.e. @ -40 evap. the capacity is 16 KW) so the cooler will be smaller and more economical..

thanks LC for your intrest..

**botrous** · 17-09-2005, 04:05 PM

Hi Mahmoud , how are you ?
I bet mates as i did myself will find those new post of yours more polite than the firsts

As for your language , congrats . . . i bet that if we have a closer look to your posts , we will not find any mistakes. . . .
As for publishing the private message you sent me and as you don't have anything to be shy from , why you are complaining about that . . . ? Your way of writing (talking) in that message really showed your respect for others and just to make the mates see how respectful and polite you are i (and out of my manners and behaviour ) published it . . .and oh yes , for the acting like adults thing , i beleive that adults are the ones adult enough to bring up the problems to the front , and that's what i did .. . and your private message showed how adult you are , I'll tell you what in your place as an adult would have done , i just had edited my post and puted a "Hi how are you in the beginning or maybe I'm new to the forum and i have a question . . . etc" then the one complaining from your way of posting (me) should have deleted his post . . .
And Mahmoud , for asking questions , including technical questions respecting saluting is the key to get answers , unless you were considering yourelf asking a machine or a computer or doing a search on the internet .

As you mentioned that the forum send you a Happy Birthday message , than happy birthday from my part.

Cheers

Best regards

**patrickj** · 17-09-2005, 07:23 PM

Hi botrous
Contravasy with Mahmoud.I think he was trying to pull a leg.I think what you did was corrrect
patrickj

**botrous** · 17-09-2005, 07:34 PM

Originally Posted by patrickj

Hi botrous
Contravasy with Mahmoud.I think he was trying to pull a leg.I think what you did was corrrect
patrickj

**Mahmoud** · 18-09-2005, 08:07 AM

Hi Botrous,,

before anything, even u r mixing honey with grease, but anyway thx for the birthday, but that doesn’t make u my friend, or that doesn’t give you the right to even write me, and by the way am polite enough with the polite ones.. - the principle of hell and heaven - hope u'll get the point.. and patrickj .. pulling a leg ?? for whom and for what ?!! .. so botrous please keep your comments for your self, and never write me or about me coz i wasn’t talking to you, and you are not from the men that i wanna have their friendships.. first impressions lasts botrous.. so enough is enough and lets close this silly chapter that u still reading and writing his papers..

**botrous** · 18-09-2005, 05:36 PM

Ok , let's close this chapter , what i've said is enough . . . the sun is shining and we all can read and figure

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