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Thread: Hall of shame.

  1. #151
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    Re: Hall of shame.



    Quote Originally Posted by hendrag View Post
    take alook at these aircon installations http://picasaweb.google.com/propernasty/HallOfShame

    most were spotted on my holidays there are many more where this came from.

    regards hendrag
    Got a laugh out of the second last one, the unit bolted up the wall on it's side.

    unfortunatley, the covers over the cond fans to force air upwards, or the obscured cassette in the ceiling, are all too common sights here, as anyone can install units with just a short course completed. And the course is primarily about not releasing refrigerant and other enviromental things, it has little to do with how refrigeration or air conditioning works, heat loads etc.
    edit: add that to the fact that installers don't have to back their own installation, (they can throw troublesome jobs to manufacturers waranty agents), means there is a lot of cowboys installing here.
    1st image shows an a/c that cooked in the summer heat, it was down the side of a house than was 10C higher than ambient. Turning the corner around the back yard to go down the side of the house that a/c was on you could feel the heat 10m away. Yeah, no **** it didn't work on hot days.
    2nd photo show a 'flare' down by an 'installer', yep, that job wouldn't be warranty, and for the price of r410a, they'd be looking at $300 for a repair and recharge. I always give the customer a chance to get the installer back to repair, (which should be free for the customer), but it always ends in me doing the repair anyway, because (1) installers don't have licenses to buy refrigerant, and (2) they don't have reclaimers or scales.
    Last edited by paul_h; 28-03-2008 at 12:17 PM.



  2. #152
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Hi Paul. Curious to know what you did with the first one. Did you have to completely change the emplacement or did you get away with just reorienting it?

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    @hendrag
    This is a common practice in Saudi Arabia and those ducts made from fiber, plastic or tin are sold ready made in market for various brands. Seems like some time that front exhaust of hot air runs in at undesirable location.Sure there are top vented models available but how often do you want an alien in your monogamous brand HVAC solution??
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by expat View Post
    Hi Paul. Curious to know what you did with the first one. Did you have to completely change the emplacement or did you get away with just reorienting it?
    I didn't install it, I work for a company that sub contracts the breakdowns. Once I identfy there's no fault with the unit, my job ends.
    But usually the installers are called back and they turn the unit 90 degrees, which they did in this case. If it won't fit sideways they put those covers over the fans instead of listening to our advice and relocationg the unit. That's why I said those covers ducting air upwards are a pretty common sight down here. I have no problems if they do that, it's just the manufacturer won't cover it if it underperforms.

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    Talking What happened to this unit ?

    Any thoughts on the cause of this sort of occurance ?
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Pressure testing with oxygen? BANG!!!

  7. #157
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Look at the pictures on this link and see if your situation looks similar.

    http://www.alder.co.za/blowup.htm

    This is a project Peter & I worked on sometime ago.
    If all else fails, ask for help.


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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by theboss View Post
    @hendrag
    This is a common practice in Saudi Arabia and those ducts made from fiber, plastic or tin are sold ready made in market for various brands. Seems like some time that front exhaust of hot air runs in at undesirable location.Sure there are top vented models available but how often do you want an alien in your monogamous brand HVAC solution??
    I was reading a panasonic ducted split manual today, and they actually endorse them. They basically said if you use these covers you're allowed to have condensing units 15cm apart.

  9. #159
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    There but for the grace of god go I.
    Thanks US Iceman for that link. Makes very interesting reading.

    Jon

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Hi Jon,

    The article Mr. Alder wrote explaining the problem was an example of several things combining to create "the perfect storm" as it were.

    It helps to illustrate how these "little" things can go drastically wrong. Some or lucky, others are not.

    Peter also translated and re-wrote the article in Dutch also.
    If all else fails, ask for help.


  11. #161
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    US Iceman, I read Mr Alder's report together with your, as would be expected, correct procedure explanation.

    I am however at odds with two things here:

    1 We still don't know where the blockage was. I mean, it has to have been in the compressor but where and how???

    2 Of course you don't deliberately induce air into a refrigeration circuit, unless of course you are at the end of you tethers and you woe the thought of going back to the office and telling your boss that it still doesn't work (without you having tried all of the obvious) and you don't know why.
    So the chap thinks to himself hmm, I'll undo both the inlet and outlet of the compressor one after the other to see if it is either drawing or discharging...,sorry but I really don't see how any amount of training could have prepared him for the result he experienced.

    This seems a horrible example of pinning it on the little guy!

    note: I have never seen written on any compressor
    "DO NOT, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, ALLOW AIR TO ENTER THIS SYSTEM FOR FEAR OF IMMEDIATE EXPLOSION".

    This sort of story worries me very much. But I am not ready to blame the Tech for it; more the gas manufacturers who seem to be given free reign in what they choose to tell us about their products and the dangers there in.

    I hope one of the b*****ds who chose not to explain it properly gets a flat tire on the side of the motorway, and gets run down by someone he was trying to flag down.

    Expat.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Expat,

    Please tell me that you are an American, now living in France.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    I'll give you a clue:

    Where I come from rubbers will not stop you getting pregnant.

    Smoking a fag in public places is antisocial but it would not get you sent to prison for murder

    We have a Queen 'cos it's better than a president init...etc

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Found this today.. the installation makes the unit recirculate large part of its condenser exhaust air..
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Not been in this game for long but seem some shocking installs. The worst of them is as follows:-

    Got called to a job where the walk in coldroom was high temp. found evap fan seized so changed and cleared ice. once done i wanted to check outdoor unit (condenser clear, pressures etc) and told it was on the roof.

    I got there to find that there was 2 wall brackets in place 4 feet up from the flat roof but no condensing unit. The unit was swinging 1 foot from the flat roof held amazingly by 3/8 (non lagged suction) and 1/4 discharge plus of course compressor electrical feed from controller (which was 1mm lighting cable). The condensing unit was originally sat on the brackets under 7 sheets of cardboard which over the months had got wet and well, did what soggy cardboard does....saggs. Plus no weathered unit housing & electrics for compressor (klixon, relay & capacitor didnt have its cover on.

    Im still amazed but this unit was still ok for pressures and ran, not that that news was much comfort for the customer.

    Cannot name names of the company who installed it but needless to say im not losing sleep over them as competitors.

    If I can find the pics I will gladly post. The shaming starts here......

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Took this pic to show my new employer a leak that had eluded previous service techs. I had little experience with this particular type of filter, so it took me a bit to realize that it had been installed backwards
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    hi guys I DONE SOME WORK AT A DAIRY FACTORY RECENTLY AND WHAT I FOUND WAS ON THE COLDROOMVCODENCINGUNIT A2.8 HP DORIN THE LIQUID LINE WAS 1/2 AND IT HAD A1/4 SIDE GLASS ,WHICH CAUSED STARVATION OF THE EVAP AND DAMAGED THE COMP valve seats on valve plate due to over heating ,THE NEXT FACTORY I WENT BY THE WAY THE SAME COWBOYS WORK WHAT HE DONE WAS HE FITTED A 10HP CONDENSER WITH THE FANS FACING THE WALL AND BLOWING ALL THE WARM AIR THROUGH THE 3HP CONDENSER NEXT TO IT THE 3 HP CONDENSER HAS A SUCTION REDUCED FROM 11/8 to 5/8 still the customer does not want to send money on getting it done correctly ,penny wise pound foolish cheers guys

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    I had one in a local hotel. Just had a deep freeze room and coldroom installled couple of months, installer could not get temperatures down, fridge at +20c and freezer, well it couldn't be used. Decided to get a second opinion on what could be wrong as John Wayne couldn't sort his own install.
    On arrival, my first question,
    "Where are the condensing units?" The reply,
    "In the boiler room." As a matter of interest, I measured the temperature in there from memory at arond 50c. Heaven help us, these muppets and muppets like them are out there earning a living at the experts expense.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamie View Post
    Hello
    One of our guys took 8 hours to install an evaporator in a cold room!after 10 hours he rang t say it just wouldnt cool,i checked the system over and after scratching me head i found the problem,he had left the orifice out of the tev i found it laying in the drip tray! Bloody Kiwi,s

    I've seen the same once. On a direct driven TK Transport unit. The driver complained of poor cooling capacity. Found lack of refrigerant. (bubles in sight glass) Tried to fill up. Then liqiud back to the compressor. Not possible to get the TEV adjusted. There was some cooling capacity due to the distributor acting as a (way to big) capilary tube. Dismantled the TXV. No orific. The installer had even installed an O-ring in the place of the orific to get the flare sealed against the TEV. Unbelievable it was not leaking.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Hi, SteinarN

    Quote Originally Posted by SteinarN View Post
    I've seen the same once. On a direct driven TK Transport unit. The driver complained of poor cooling capacity. Found lack of refrigerant. (bubles in sight glass) Tried to fill up. Then liqiud back to the compressor. Not possible to get the TEV adjusted. There was some cooling capacity due to the distributor acting as a (way to big) capilary tube. Dismantled the TXV. No orific. The installer had even installed an O-ring in the place of the orific to get the flare sealed against the TEV. Unbelievable it was not leaking.
    .... why unbelievable....take a look at my sig

    Best regards, Josip

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Wish I had a photo of it to show but did not think at the time.
    I saw 10 air conditioning units stood one in front of the other. They were only about 18inch apart and all faceing the same way.
    The air from unit one was sucked into unit two, unit two's air was sucked into unit three, unit three's air was sucked into unit four.
    You get where this is going?
    Units six onwards only worked when the unit infront was off on HP.

    taz.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by taz24 View Post
    Wish I had a photo of it to show but did not think at the time.
    I saw 10 air conditioning units stood one in front of the other. They were only about 18inch apart and all faceing the same way.
    The air from unit one was sucked into unit two, unit two's air was sucked into unit three, unit three's air was sucked into unit four.
    You get where this is going?
    Units six onwards only worked when the unit infront was off on HP.

    taz.
    Now, when I am officialy citizen off EU, I am looking for decent job! For any job offer please check my profile!

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Nice one...

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    its not a story but a picture says a thousand words go to www.mylg.co.uk and click the hall of shame . check the boys in the pool at the end priceless

    enjoy and email any more i will put them in the hall

    regards

    hendrag

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Hall of shame
    sad but true, called to site to ceck recent A/C install. Dishy blond at reception not happy. Check out door C/U, problem 1, installer used discarded tyre from tyre bay for vibration isolation, on slight angled roof , add windage, unit face down. Compressor stuffed, problem 2 installer obviously lost his tube cutter, so left rest of 15 metre coil of pipe connected next to C/U unisulated. consequently wasnt paid and was billed for recovery.
    magoo

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Hall of shame.
    Hi rise bldg manager having hissy fit with A/C central plant contractors. Could I have a walk through and comment?. OK ten minutes in plant room, water temps balistic. Problem centrif compressor going wrong way. Short fix apart from fact the compressor was stuffed once direction was corrected.
    magoo

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    One of the most unusual leaks I've heard about was in a unit with dual evaporators. There was a leak where the liquid line branched to two TXVs. (Visualize a single liquid line on one end of the fitting and two smaller liquid lines side by side on the other.) Apparently, the brazing was marginal so it cracked between the two smaller lines.

    Strange thing is, ever since I heard about it, I somehow get reminded about it every month!

  28. #178
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Sent a qualified frigee to find a leak on a supermarket multi rack. Found out the next day he had ordered 10 jugs of R404 and hadput 12 jugs 404 in the previous day. Walked into the supermarket and found him walking around with a halide leak detector.


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    Re: Hall of shame.

    That guy is really over-qualified .
    Last edited by nike123; 02-03-2008 at 08:28 AM.
    Now, when I am officialy citizen off EU, I am looking for decent job! For any job offer please check my profile!

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    At least he was looking for the leak

    I used to get sent to site with the instructions "it always leaks at this time of year, just top it up"

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    how in blue blazes can someone forget about the dam orifice you might as well forget to put underwear on

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    I used to get sent to site with the instructions "it always leaks at this time of year, just top it up"
    Or in the case of the "strange leak" I mentioned earlier, "It always leaks this time of month, just charge it."

  33. #183
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Or in the case of the "strange leak" I mentioned earlier, "It always leaks this time of month, just charge it
    If you add another little TEV that strange leak may stop for the best part of a year. BE WARNED this might put to much strain on the compressor ( I assume you have a recip....)

  34. #184
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Years ago, before recovering gas was even thought about, I went to Sainsbury's in Chingford and found an old Marstair A/C runnign their computer room. It was running but not working, I put the gauges on and had almost equla pressures. I thought the compressors not pumping, but something was not quite right. I let some gas out and my head guage sprang roung from 100lbs/in2 to 450lbs/in2. It was so overcharged it was impossible for the compressor to compress the gas. It made me jump a bit! Purged off some more it worked fine. And nuts to the ozone layer and global warming! We had never heard of it back then.
    Last edited by Refrigerologist; 16-03-2008 at 11:58 PM.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Doe anyone remember those halcyon days when we were all cowboys! Condensers were cleaned with liquid R12. R11 was great for cleaning up after a burn out. And you could still have fun at work because there was no health and safety Gestapo. Wasn't it fun to leave the apprentice laying on a cable tray 20ft in the air above a ceiling and then go for a cup of tea because he had been a right little S***. It was so much easier then, just like it is in China now or maybe France today!!
    Last edited by Refrigerologist; 16-03-2008 at 11:35 PM.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Hello . Im a newbie to the boards . Being in Chicago we have relief valves on all systems that have more than thirty pounds of refrigerant in the seal system . Third year in the trade I was sent out to pump down a trane 40 ton condenser . Having my gauges after the liquid line valve i didn't realize that the pressure got above the 450 pd setting of the valve . My hearing didn't come back for a few hours . Only happen once . Live and learn .

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    This is a warning to always check for yourself: When I was a 16 year old apprentice, I was assisting an engineer who found 2 x 200amp main fuses blown. He traced the fault to the plant room extract fan control panel. The door mounted speed selecter switch had a dead short between 2 phases. He duely removed the switch and we went back to our workshops. He told the service manager that a new switch was required. He then went on another service call.

    The service mangager checked the switch with his multi-meter and found no fault, he handed it to my supervisor and told him to refit it and find the real fault. Off we went to site. The super didn't like the other engineer and so he thought he must have made another co*k up. He installed the switch and with the control panel door open he told me to throw the circuit breaker. The switch blew up in his face, removing his eyerows, some of his hair and blasted his face with molten brass. After he had calmed down a little, and got his sight back, he checked the switch with a meggar, as the other guy had done, lo and behold, dead short! He drove back to the workshop, foot to the floor. 30 odd years later I believe the switch is still being removed from the service managers' arse!
    Last edited by Refrigerologist; 19-03-2008 at 07:27 PM.

  38. #188
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    Thumbs up Re: Hall of shame.

    Hi Guys-just listen to this awful tale of woe!
    got myself called to a bit of a Zanussi table top fridge recently by an old dear dear whose butter was 'going off'. Some joker had installed the unit for her, but only left the knob set on '1' !!!!
    didnt take me long to figure the problem and reset the knob to '3'.
    Guess the first guy was just totally incompetent or something!!!
    Sorry but photos didnt turn out.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by hendrag View Post
    its not a story but a picture says a thousand words go to www.mylg.co.uk and click the hall of shame . check the boys in the pool at the end priceless

    enjoy and email any more i will put them in the hall

    regards

    hendrag
    Here's another one for your collection. Went to survey a job for a new system where the existing A/C had packed a year before.
    Here's what I found - and this one's in the UK.
    Actually the rotten crate wasn't responsible for killing the cond unit because it looked to me like the gardeners shears had gone through the coil!! Our engineers had to take some electric hedge trimmers with them when we did the install for the replacement system so they could get the old unit out.
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    hi everyone this is one i came across last summer, a polish sparky installed ac system in his shop wasnt workin so i went to have a look. Found unit running on deep vac but bags of gasin high side. Ok its a blockage traced problem to indoor unit found he had removed the flare connections and used plumbers solder on the pipework reclaimed the gas and cut out the joint on the liquid line it was full of flux blocked solid what a muppet changed all his joints pressure tested vaced and gased good job it wasnt a 410 unit

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    Thumbs up Re: Hall of shame.

    was ask to survey a resturuant a week ago. pulled in behind kitchen parked in front of a condenser ref. type.talked with owner, looked over and recorded a/c stuff-well maintained/ten yaers old. noticed old kramer condenser coil on roof? recorded all the stuff in the bar, then to the kitchen.found five more reach ins, one was an old herrel make table from the early 60's! one old herrel steel/fiberglass W/I cooler, and a modern foam insulated W/I cooler freezer. now some of these unit had line sets running out. so down in the basement i went! found an abandoned open drive commpressor-- thats it! that old presscold condenser i parked in front of was driving all three walk ins, two make tables in the kitchen, and a large three door diplay case and 8' bottle box at the bar! i'm guessing it did not have enough cond. surface so that explains the grafted on kramer coil on the roof. Man-o-man can you imagine walking up on this on an emergency call-mabey rainy night /customer flippin because most of his stuff doesn't work???
    thats not all, there was a B model manatowoc- had a full bin. line set sticking out back.found condensing unit 75' away! was made out of an old arcoair roundtype a/c condenser circ.80'. looked down inside only to find a little tiny tecumseh and about three valves i would imagine are for defrost.
    now i've been doing this [ref. work] for twenty years,and i am thoroughly IMPRESSED. every box was cold!!! I WOULD LIKE TO WORK WITH THIS GUY A COUPLE MONTHS-I AM POSITIVE THERES MUCH TO LEARN FROM HIM!!!! sorry i had not thought to bring my camera!

  42. #192
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    There are probably more shoddy jobs then there is space to write them down,and not all by poorly trained people.I went to service some Ahu,s in a well known hotel only to find that it was impossible to gain access to,they were in a false ceiling in the lobby fifty feet up with no accsess door.

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    Re: Hall of shame.

    A friend of mine is an automotive technician (without A/C). He opened up a shop of his own and decided to try A/C without any training as he had a friend that he could consult at a dealership. He asked me to come down to his shop one day and help him understand what went wrong with his new compressor install. The compressor was seized and there was water everywhere. I asked him what he had done and this was his reply :
    " Since the last compressor failed I decided to flush the system out so I hooked up the garden hose to the discharge port and let it run through for a 1/2 hour. Once I got the new compressor in I hooked up the gauges to the vacuum line on the engine and let it run for a couple hours since I don't have a vacuum pump. I charged the system with 1 pound of R134 and when I turned it on it only ran for 3-4 seconds before seizing again." I explained to him that if he ever touched another A/C system again I would burn his shop down, and his friend should be stripped of any technical status he has ever recieved!

  44. #194
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by prasky View Post
    A friend of mine is an automotive technician (without A/C). He opened up a shop of his own and decided to try A/C without any training as he had a friend that he could consult at a dealership. He asked me to come down to his shop one day and help him understand what went wrong with his new compressor install. The compressor was seized and there was water everywhere. I asked him what he had done and this was his reply :
    " Since the last compressor failed I decided to flush the system out so I hooked up the garden hose to the discharge port and let it run through for a 1/2 hour. Once I got the new compressor in I hooked up the gauges to the vacuum line on the engine and let it run for a couple hours since I don't have a vacuum pump. I charged the system with 1 pound of R134 and when I turned it on it only ran for 3-4 seconds before seizing again." I explained to him that if he ever touched another A/C system again I would burn his shop down, and his friend should be stripped of any technical status he has ever recieved!

    Holy ****

    This must be the worst I have ever heard of.

  45. #195
    nevgee's Avatar
    nevgee is offline Veteran Poster I am starting to push the Mods: of RE
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    This pic shows a 1 1/8 suction line that has been re connected after a compressor change. The fitting used is a 35mm "Yorkshire" soldering fitting intended for water pipework. I wonder where the soft solder went?

    By the way, the compressor only ran for 4 weeks and has since locked up!!
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  46. #196
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    thanks for sendin me more quality pictures i will upload them again the collection is now full of some beutiful examples of installations. they never cease to make me laugh .

    thanks for looking www.mylg.co.uk click hall of shame

    regards

    hendrag
    general Manager lgeuk

  47. #197
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    yeah nice one,i had similiar problem Hi there, i once had a coldroom to commission, a little 1/2 hp L'unite con unit, Pressure test and vac out, charge with R134a. When i run it, it ran into a full vacuum i couldnt understand why, i kept adding gas, stillrunning in vacuum, checked all valves all seemed ok, I had to take the gas out and take unit apart to discover why, I found a small red plastic plug still in the opening of the liquid rotolack valve. I swore at the install guy, He just laughed.

  48. #198
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    Re: Hall of shame.


  49. #199
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    Re: Hall of shame - Welds chicken poop are they good ? Rate it !

    Please advise if this porous chicken poop look is normal ?

    - Cheers All had a local australian tech replace upper and lower EV valve on a multisplit here.

    First one valve didn't flow at all, told faulty valve mmm ok or was it welding?, second time round overhead nearby end cap - now leaking gas.

    Last time I checked even our local plumber did better rewelds than this......
    Yeah and no pride, look at all the stuff left behind....
    It's always a great sign to know the main job is stuffed as well
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  50. #200
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    Re: Hall of shame.

    Ignore, double post!
    Last edited by nike123; 07-12-2008 at 12:32 PM.
    Now, when I am officialy citizen off EU, I am looking for decent job! For any job offer please check my profile!

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