HELP!! changing from company car to van

[willies boy]

Got a meeting in 2 weeks to change from estate cars to vans ,we have private use /fuel at moment ,this will change to NO private use,.The issue is the lack of a car for w/ends etc plus if missus is using her car ill be stuck with a van i cant use,anyone see a good arguement for staying with car on all points including tax issues etc,need to go fully prepared with facts n figures to counteract their reasoning.Contract states VEHICLE will be provided for company use ,do i have ANY leverage here or am i just pissing up a tree??Just in case they come at me with the "refrigerants in car" bull has anyone gone down this route already??

[monkey spanners]

Theres two issues here, changing from a car to a van, and no personal use.

Personally i prefer a van, but i guess it depends on what equipment you work on.

My old employer tried the no personal use thing with us, so we all said that we didn't want a vehicle on our drive that we couldn't move unless we was working so we'd leave them at the yard thankyou, take our personal tools out and buy an old banger between us to get us to work and back.
Which the boss liked till he realised we wouldn't be available for out of hours work etc, heh, put a stop to that one!
I used to just put a tank of diesel in it every now and then to pay for any use i had of it.

[willies boy]

mmmm my "depot" is over 120 miles away ,im home based ,so the "leave vehicle at work" wont do ,we are not on call ever ,so thats gone also,only lever i think we have is that we are paid 40 hrs for a 45 hr week ,been suggested that as they now add 1 hour per day getting to and from "work"with a van we will say we are already at work from the door of house??and only do the 40hr week

[monkey spanners]

Seems to me that you getting to and from work is private use, if they ain't paying, you ain't working....

Still i have worked for myself for the last seven years after i got fed up with this sort of nonsense from employers.

Good luck!

Jon

[cool runings]

mmmm my "depot" is over 120 miles away ,im home based ,so the "leave vehicle at work" wont do ,we are not on call ever ,so thats gone also,only lever i think we have is that we are paid 40 hrs for a 45 hr week ,been suggested that as they now add 1 hour per day getting to and from "work"with a van we will say we are already at work from the door of house??and only do the 40hr week

The tax man expects you to travel for the first 30 mins in your own time, so if you are not alowed to use the van for personal use then you should leave the thing in a yard or travel on company time.

Tax and first job can be complicated.

So if you are 100 odd miles from depot then you can use that as a reasoning point.
But for your boss the van will be cheaper than a car so I would expect him to pass on some of the benifit to the staff.

If all else fails then tell him you do not want the van on your drive and that might force the issue.
Trouble is he might just threaten you all with the sack or back down..

All the best cool

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[willies boy]

Thanks Cool,thats my view ,there is only so far you can push it,the leaving van at work is a non starter,its the private use thing thats the pisser ,aint bothered about the tax but am going to try to negotiate a crew cab thing,but then thats same tax as car and van so they may be just after the non private use ,so ill be prepared to pay for fuel,ill keep yall posted as this will be coming to a company near you !!

[Spencer.Guy]

You've previously have the benefit of a car / fuel for private use, that has a value hence the penalty of tax coding for it.
Loose the car and you loose a benefit with a value, you need compensating for that loss.
The minimum it needs to be is the cost of financing your own car with fuel and you'll need your drive clear to park that on, so the van goes on the road.

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[willies boy]

Hey thats a good point worth persueing,thanks

[james10]

Thanks Cool,thats my view ,there is only so far you can push it,the leaving van at work is a non starter,its the private use thing thats the pisser ,aint bothered about the tax but am going to try to negotiate a crew cab thing,but then thats same tax as car and van so they may be just after the non private use ,so ill be prepared to pay for fuel,ill keep yall posted as this will be coming to a company near you !!

I had a crew cab at my previous employer the tax is the same as a standard van as the pay load exeeds 1 tonne(same for any veichle ie mitsi warrior) the one i had was a renault traffic and i couldn't fault it i'd have one over a car any day

[Quality]

I think I must Have missed the point here - you want a company vehicle or don`t - to earn your living ,get paid to have it all yourself ,use it for your own purpose without any cost or expense. I am not being harsh but come on

[Grizzly]

From an individuals Tax liability point of view.
I am led to believe their is now little difference between having a car or Van.
Your P11D form ( Taxable Benefit )
Is calculated on
A) The Vehicle List price value, that is set by the tax man. And not what you pay for it. Which is usually a higher figure.
A1) Any Capital Contribution by you to-wards the purchase.
A2) Any private use contribution you have made.
B) Fuel benefit in kind. ( Private mileage usage) If you are not in a company scheme to pay for your private mileage.
The benefit is calculated by the list price of the vehicle, fuel type and the CO2 rating of the vehicle.
I cannot say for sure as how fuel efficient the new vans are?
Maybe some of the guys will be able to say?
I am at present issued with an estate car which even with a fully loaded boot and high speed motorway driving.
Delivers around 50 to the gallon.
Are vans as economical?
I know a lot of guys prefer the flexibility that a fully "tooled up" Van gives. I have been there myself and they can be more beneficial.
And assume for specific work like Supermarket maintenace a Van would make more sence.
Nowadays because of the huge variety of equipment we are expected to work on.
Whatever we were to carry would not be enough.
So initial response is Rapid and if deemed necessary.
On return with the relevant components / equipment we use the Depot LGV.
It works for us!
So does anyone know for sure who saves when Engineers are issued with either Vans or Cars?
I am assuming that a lot of the High spec Vans now being issued are similar in price to cars?
From what you Guys have been saying the seem to cost as much to keep on the road. If not more.
Cheers Grizzly.

[Brian_UK]

Just another little fly in the ointment but I believe if the van weighs over 1538kg then really you need authorisation from your local Council to park it; operators licence or similar.

[Grizzly]

Just another little fly in the ointment but I believe if the van weighs over 1538kg then really you need authorisation from your local Council to park it; operators licence or similar.

That's an interesting fact Brian!
That would be un-laden weight I assume?
Would that not mean that the Vehicle Licence Catagory changes also?
Grizzly

[RogerCool]

You could always add some mileage to each job to cover your private use but beware company insurance will probaly not cover you for private use but with the money you save on tax, insure it yourself, or tell them straight your all leaving if he retracts your benefit and as its the right time of year for work surely he can not replace you all!

[Spencer.Guy]

I think I must Have missed the point here - you want a company vehicle or don`t - to earn your living ,get paid to have it all yourself ,use it for your own purpose without any cost or expense. I am not being harsh but come on

Presumably when Willies Boy took the job they agreed to pay him so much in cash and then give use of a car with free private use.
The total is his reward for working for them.

They now proposes to reduce what they are giving him.
It's the same as taking cash away from him, would you agree to a pay drop?

My vehicle is fully funded for private use, no mileage limit.
It's part of the total package.

If they took private use away from me I'd want cash to make up for it.

It's a brand new SWB low roof Transit and it does 37mpg.

.

[Quality]

Fair comment That one

[willies boy]

Spencer.Guy that is it ,i have a fully expensed car,we work on small kithen chillers/fzrs,i carry all but compressors.I dont need anything bigger ,they have not had an issue with 1st time fixes in over 3 yrs.now they look to remove the car with a van with NO private use ,that as the man says is removing money from my pocket,car is also on a tracker ,so van will be therefore fuel or not you will be seen to be using it outside of work

[Spencer.Guy]

I suspect the fact you have had a fully funded car for 3 years overrules the statement of a Vehicle.
Custom and Practice it's called; (last para)

http://www.worksmart.org.uk/rights/pay_and_contracts


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