multi city error code 1102

[sork]

hi there lads
happy new year to all engineers
i am working on multi city , group of indoors not operating, error code 1102 apeares. shut down power to that comp and wait 20 min then turn it on , on the outdoor board reads 0615 flashing then change to 51 flashing , change to 410 flashing and finally to r-08 flashing then only 1 apears whereas on other units 11 1 1 apears. the indoor local controller shows code 1102 again.

mitsubishi error code 1102 says discharge temp (above 110 deg c )(th1) 407c th11 410 a possibly short of gas, lev3 problem condensor blocked, condensor fan faulty.
what next??????

[Brian_UK]

What Next?

Tell your employer that you need a training course on this product.

That's what I've done as these systems are too involved for simple fault finding. You waste too much time and embarrass yourself in front of the customer because you can't resolve what could be a simple problem.

Nothing personal here, I just get tee'd off with the idea that because we've got a screwdriver and a van we can fix anything in twenty-five minutes. [end rant]

[Thermatech]

The flashing codes when switch on 3 ph power is normal for all City Multi outdoor units.
This lasts for 2 or 3 mins while the outdoor unit carries out electronic hand shake with all indoor units.
If you had ever switched on 3ph power to a City Multi outdoor unit before you would know that this is normal process.

Next step is to use the engineers mode on the outdoor circuit board to display the TH1 sensor data.

You do need a service manual & get on a training course otherwise you give the product & our trade a bad name because this is a straight forward fault which an engineer could identify within 1/2 hr on site.

[sork]

hi i check the thermister got no resistance.

[marc5180]

In your first post you said "1102" is

"possibly short of gas, lev3 problem condensor blocked, condensor fan faulty"

Have you checked any of these.

A fault like this should be relatively straight forward.

If it isn't then you need to get booked in on a City Multi training course as the others say.
Beleive me it's worth it

[marc5180]

I've just re-read your post, you have no resistance on the discharge sensor?

If thats the case your sensor is damaged.

Are you sure that you aren't getting any resistance on it?

Have you taken it out of the plug that goes onto the board to get a better reading?

Sometimes the probes don't make contact with it fully which would give you a false reading

[sork]

thank you everybody espcially marc and techmath

[sork]

i measured thermister , it was ok but i swaped it with next unit to make sure, the other comp works ok , but 1102 apeared again on this one.
gauge shows 150 psig standing on R410a.
this comp does not start at all, i checked pressure switch its ok.
checked comp winding , it reads 0.7 on s r c .

[marc5180]

I thought the thermister had no resistance?

Have you reset the power to the condensor and then turned back on? Does the outdoor unit run ?.

You really need the outdoor service manual in order to fault find with these units.
Whats the model number?

[Thermatech]

Perhaps you have one of the larger City Multi units which have 2 compressors.
The direct on line compressor discharge temp sensor is Th12 & if that is fault / open circuit or reading more than 120 deg C then also 1102 fault.
The discharge temp sensor for the inverter compressor is TH11 & if that is reading more than 120 deg C or open circuit then also 1102 fault.

You can check any temperature sensor data by using the SW1 dips & LED display on the outdoor circuit board. This is always the best test for temperature sensors because the circuit board displays the the same data it can see from the resistance from the sensor & it only takes a few seconds to do the SW1 dip setting.
But to do this you need service manual for the exact model you have on site.

[sork]

the following is the outdoor details:
outdoor unit details(o/u)
model no: PQRY-P200YGM-A
serial no:78w00034
comp model no:HNB71FA-YB
comp serial no :78W24794
power source(V):
L1-N 230
L2-N 230
L3-N 230
E-N 0
indoor model no:PEFY-P20VML-E

indoor serial no:75W11950

BC CONTROLLER(MASTER):
MODEL NO: CMB-P1010V-GA
SERIAL NO :7YW02896
any of you near me drop by you will be treated fairly

[marc5180]

Are you sure it is a PQRY and not a PURY?

If you are then you have a R410A Water Cooled Condensing Unit?

[marc5180]

The discharge sensor is TH4 i think.

You can get it's values by checking SW1 on the outdoor board put numbers 1,3,4 + 6 to on.... this will tell you what the discharge sensor is reading.

Has this system ran whilst you have been with it?

[sork]

yes i am sure there are 6 outdoor sharing the DRY AIR condensor NVR 1330 .

[sork]

yes it is running with R410A at standing pressure of 150 psig , the other comp (5 of them) have been running no prob , this one i have not seen it running.
most of indoor coils connected to this outdoor have local remote PAC-SE51CRA, the screen on them goes off(SHADED) immidiatly and the power circle stays each time when i press on/off switch, when i reverse the address no in the G50 controller several second later it goes off.
the malfunction on G50 shows no error.
one of the local controller PAR-21MAA goes off immidiatly after i press on/off botton shows the screen standby plus all modes. when i press test botton it shows 1102 and address no of the room.

[Thermatech]

On PQRY200YGM-A
Discharge temp sensor still TH11 as other City Multi units.
It is on the compressor discharge tube & has completely different ohms reading from all the other sensors at the outdoor unit as it has to read the highest temperature. So it is clear which one it is.

For 1102 fault & compressor never starting the sensor will be one of the following.
1/ open circuit
2/ closed circuit
3/ reading more than 120 deg C

If the compressor does run but discharge does run at 120 deg C then there will be some refrigerant flow problem or water flow problem in the system making very low suction pressure which will cause compressor overheat high discharge temp & high discharge SH.

But I am not going to start giving you the dip settings otherwise you are going to be on here every 5 mins asking for the dip settings for somthing else.
You need the service manual & then you can read any data you want from the outdoor circuit board.

The Mitsubishi tech help desk opens at 9am Monday morning.

[Thermatech]

The indoor units will not start if 240v power not on.
Mnet remote controller with address dips.
In this case the remote controller goes blank after a few seconds but small dot / circle only is displayed.
This indicate the indoor unit has 30v dc control voltage only.

If the outdoor unit has 1102 fault it will be displayed at the outdoor circuit board & will be reported at the G50.

You have a combination of 30v dc Mnet Hotel type remote controllers & 12v dc PAR21 remote controller in the same system.
This is not normal & not really recommended.

If the outdoor unit is not displaying 1102 on the display & not showing 1102 fault at the G50 then I suspect the system is ready to run but does not because of power supply problem at indoor units.

[sork]

thank you thermatech when i went to the site first time , there was no power to 7 of the indoor units, but on my second visit all indoor coils had power.
i understand the proceedure of the controllers both local and g50's now and can concentrate on the indoor power supply .

[marc5180]

On PQRY200YGM-A
Discharge temp sensor still TH11 as other City Multi units.
It is on the compressor discharge tube & has completely different ohms reading from all the other sensors at the outdoor unit as it has to read the highest temperature. So it is clear which one it is.

For 1102 fault & compressor never starting the sensor will be one of the following.
1/ open circuit
2/ closed circuit
3/ reading more than 120 deg C

If the compressor does run but discharge does run at 120 deg C then there will be some refrigerant flow problem or water flow problem in the system making very low suction pressure which will cause compressor overheat high discharge temp & high discharge SH.

But I am not going to start giving you the dip settings otherwise you are going to be on here every 5 mins asking for the dip settings for somthing else.
You need the service manual & then you can read any data you want from the outdoor circuit board.

The Mitsubishi tech help desk opens at 9am Monday morning.

Whats the difference between YGMA and YHMA? is it just that the latter has been superseeded?

I was looking at YHMA service manual and it shows the Discharge sensor as TH4 on the refrigerant drawing.

TH11 in this book is the BC Box LEV control, Liquid inlet temp.

I'm not questioning you just myself

[Thermatech]

Valid point
discharge temp sensor is TH4 on the very latest City Multi products including water cooled PQRY YHM-A
I commissioned my first PQRY YHM-A units in November 2009 so I think they have only used up the old stock of YGM-A units reciently.

The compressor discharge temp sensor was always TH1 on the old R22 systems with one compressor. Then when they started making the larger units with two compressors they called discharge temp sensors inverter comp TH11 & direct on line comp TH12.

That how it been for about 18 years until now & the current model YHM-A which has discharge temp sensor TH4.

That why its important to have the correct service manual for the system you are working on.
If you notice the PQRY YGM-A manual is 235 pages.
I do not have a photographic memory so I cant recall all the technical info from 235 pages but I do know that I can find most information for trouble shooting in the service manual.

[sork]

thank you all we have done it.the prob was not the th11 or other sensors p or t . it was the communication btw indoor bc and the outdoor , the outdoor was unable to shake land with the address no .
it is not bad idea to do the course , if mr t woudnot explain the thrio power source i would be still at it.
happy new year to you all