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19-12-2009, 02:01 PM #1
New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Haven't been on the RE Boards for awhile - good to see the regulars are still around - good to be back.
I know that for whatever the reason there seems to be a trickle effect between the trade brothers in the States and our brothers over here when it comes to dissemination of new instrument and equipment news and releases - I was surprised to see Nike had posted up the thread on the Get Cool package, but was happy to see it.
Wanted to show you guys this new concept in manifold design, because I think it will be especially beneficial to refrigeration engineers -
Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ 2 Valve Manifold
Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ 4 Valve Manifold
I ask you are those a work of art or what? Solid brass construction, specially designed ball valves, push button valve design. Full manifold specifications have been published here: http://digitalzeus.wordpress.com/200...%A2-explained/
I'm interested in hearing the opinions and impressions of this manifold from a slightly different perspective that I think you guys can offer - definitely would appreciate it.
Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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19-12-2009, 02:38 PM #2
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Too complicated, too bulky & awful valve adjusters. I would not buy it. Sorry.
Engineering Specialist - Cuprobraze, Nocolok, CD Technology
Rarefied Technologies ( SE Asia )
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19-12-2009, 02:57 PM #3
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Thanks for the reply desA - appreciate it. No need to be sorry, I have no financial interests in the manifold at all just interested, as I said in differing perspectives.
I would like to ask clarification - (1). Too complicated - could you elaborate on this opinion please. (2). Too bulky - are you referencing this from a weight perspective or structure profile? From a structural perspective the profile is 'lower' than current manifold design conventions. (3). Awful valve adjusters - I'm not certain if you are describing the push button design on the 4 valve or the ball valve operators (in which case porting can be adjusted from closed to full porting with only a 90º turn), or are you describing both?
Thanks again for the opinions bro - appreciate it.Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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19-12-2009, 04:14 PM #4
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
^ No problems.
I like the simplicity of the classic Imperial-style brass manifold. To support the gauges & hose-connectors, there doesn't need to be so much brass - it looks very bulky there. This bulkiness also applies to the central section around the push-buttons.
For the 90-degree ball-valve operators, I prefer to have gradual adjustment & this is where a rotating, slow action 'knob' is useful.
I'm pretty sure others will disagree, but, I'm never one for a 'pretty tool', but rather simple functionality at a fair price. I hope the comments are useful.Engineering Specialist - Cuprobraze, Nocolok, CD Technology
Rarefied Technologies ( SE Asia )
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19-12-2009, 05:51 PM #5
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Nothing at all wrong with the classic Imperials - have several of them myself that I prefer over similar designs by other OEM's like Ritchie.
This bulkiness also applies to the central section around the push-buttons.
For the 90-degree ball-valve operators, I prefer to have gradual adjustment & this is where a rotating, slow action 'knob' is useful.
Originally Posted by Digital ZeusI'm pretty sure others will disagree, but, I'm never one for a 'pretty tool', but rather simple functionality at a fair price. I hope the comments are useful.Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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19-12-2009, 08:44 PM #6
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
I like it, but I would prefer a safety spring clip testo-style, than the usual question mark hook.
I don't like the membrane buttons. In the long run, they are prone to fracturing the membrane. I would prefer silicon push buttons, tv-remote style.
The brass block is a nice piece of machining.
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19-12-2009, 09:44 PM #7
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Thanks No Nick - I like the carbineer style hook like that found on the Testo® 500 RSA Series as well - I don't have any information on the hook style being incorporated with the Paradigm™ but assume it is likely a conventional hook.
I am also not altogether certain that the push buttons work in conjunction with a membrane as one would expect either - I'll see if I can get more information in that regard - thanks for the reply.Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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20-12-2009, 01:35 AM #8
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
The ball valves are supposed to be a proportional style valve rather than the standard type of valve.
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20-12-2009, 02:09 AM #9
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Yep - you're right JP, they are specially designed - are patent pending and are proportional.
Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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20-12-2009, 03:17 AM #10
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Is this an advert?
Engineering Specialist - Cuprobraze, Nocolok, CD Technology
Rarefied Technologies ( SE Asia )
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20-12-2009, 03:57 AM #11
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Absolutely not. Just answering the responses as I am notified of them since I authored the thread. Genuinely interested in diverse perspectives on the design since it is such a drastic departure from what any of us - here, there or wherever have ever seen or used.
I know there are a lot of American members here, but this Board probably has the most diverse cross section of members - demographically speaking - of any other trade specific network or forum in the world and even though we are all brothers in a common trade, there are so many differences between countries and nations when it comes to applications, processes, materials, tools, instruments - the way we think about them, use them and something as simple as the way we store them vary greatly from one technician/engineer/mechanic to the next, I am interested in the varying opinions. As I said earlier upstream - I personally have absolutely no financial interest in this manifold, the OEM or it's success or failure.Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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22-12-2009, 05:32 AM #12
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
I think it could lose the sight glass which would de-bulk it a little. I've never seen much use in a sight glass in manifolds although I'm sure some may like them. The side adjusters look more prone to breakage if the manifold fell on its side. Round metal handles would be better. What is the middle female port for? The gauge hose fittings in the bottom look pretty agricultural. In saying that the basic concept is good and just needs a little streamlining.
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22-12-2009, 01:26 PM #13
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Seems typical American design philosophy
"If you can't make it big: make it bigger"
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22-12-2009, 05:24 PM #14
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Yes I agree elimination of the sight glass would streamline the bar - an integrated manifold sight glass serves in multiple functions actually - the most obvious of which is serving as an observation port to observe the refrigerant stream as it passes through the gauge set. Bubbles can be observed in the liquid stream and the condition (color) of refrigerant and oil which can indicate impurities in the stream. In my opinion those capabilities alone merit integration of the sight glass into this or any other manifold. Round handles would contradict the design intent of feed rate manipulation of the ball valves - also I am thinking I like the ability to control feed with a single finger as opposed to spinning a conventional wheel design.
What is the middle female port for?
Forgive my ignorance but I'm not familiar with the term, "looks pretty agricultural", would you care to elaborate? Thanks!Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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22-12-2009, 05:29 PM #15
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
I hate to be the one to dampen your apparent racism, but I'm afraid it is not an American design. And since your response is derogatory from a personal perspective I will also not dignify anything else you may have to add to this thread with a reply.
They can do wonders with therapy these days - perhaps you should consider seeking some.Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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22-12-2009, 06:09 PM #16
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
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22-12-2009, 11:09 PM #17
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
I think i would prefer round taps rather than levers, less likely to move if the manifold is led on the floor.
But i've had the same Refco manifold for 18 years so round taps is what i'm used to
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23-12-2009, 12:51 AM #18
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23-12-2009, 12:59 AM #19
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Yea I think you just hit the proverbial nail on the head Spanners in the latter section of your reply we're probably all guilty of becoming too comfortable and acclimated to what the industry OEM's, like Refco, Yellow Jacket and Imperial - among others have been shoving down our throat as 'conventional' for close to a century.
Any departure from those conventions makes us uncomfortable nervous - look at the digital manifold gauge - a prime example of what I'm talking about.
Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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23-12-2009, 01:19 AM #20
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Precisely - and although I refuse to respond to anything the quoted author you cited has to say - I am somewhat mystified that he is able to determine manifold weight based on design renderings. Or for that matter arrive at the conclusion that the design is 'old fashioned' I would love to see supporting documentation - patent application(s) or otherwise that even remotely approaches the design concept of this manifold.
Additionally I think a critical design feature of these new manifolds - not just the Paradigm™ that are being overlooked relevant to concerns and comments about "bulk" is the fact the the new generation manifolds are being bored to accomodate full and very near full 3/8" bore paths, obviously the manifold "bar" is going to have to be larger to facilitate a bore of this diameter.
Let's look at Refco for a moment - and I love the Refco analog manifols sets - probably among the top three highest quality analogs OEM's any where in the world - but look at the structural size and weight of two of their best selling manifolds:
This things are heavy and large - but maybe he has an issue with Swiss design conceptual philosophies as well.Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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23-12-2009, 10:21 AM #21
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Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
I don't care at look of tool, my only concern is function.
First thing what bothers me here is (if I understood that correctly) that push button design for vacuum and charging ports.
If that mean that I could only select one or another, and not both port fully open or fully closed simultaneously, I am against that design.
Second, I am pretty concerned about easy possibility to accidentally open ball valve with this lever-instead-of-wheel design of high and low side valves handles or push buttons design of vacuum and charge valves.
Third concern is ability to hold vacuum at 20microns with ball valve design as oppose to Apion Megaflow design.
I think these points are not been well taught when this design is been considered.
But, I could, sometimes, be very wrong.
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23-12-2009, 12:10 PM #22
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Thanks for the observations Nike, but they are a little misguided - a better description of the design and function of the characterized proportional ball valve and the depression valves can be found here: http://digitalzeus.wordpress.com/200...%A2-explained/
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
I don't care at look of tool, my only concern is function.Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. If we continue to develop our technology without wisdom or prudence, our servant may prove to be our executioner.
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23-12-2009, 04:21 PM #23
Re: New Digi-Cool® Paradigm™ Manifold
Can't say I have.Can't say I will either...
I use the CPS standard set and it's more than adequate..US made I believe ? They live in their own little box tucked up and safe as houses.
I have no need for anything else. The rest is supply house counter BS to me.
I have noticed on HVAC-Talk there is a certain amount of 'manifold gauge' envy. You occasionally see the odd "I carry six sets of gauges, anyone who doesn't is a pussy" thead there etc
I have never seen it in the UK..but who knows as I lead a very sheltered life...
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