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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    France
    Age
    39
    Posts
    88
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    11

    [Autocascade] Only a project ATM



    Well, I'd like to recover some space in my laboratory... it's pretty large actually but I find my cascades to take too much space: the 3-stager especially, but my big 2-stager is definitely not small actually

    So I'm thinking of building an 'all-in-one' autocascade. I mean to replace my two actual cascades.

    The needs

    - Covering temperature range within -100 to -130C (+ or - 20C : )
    - Minimal size
    - Flexibility of move

    Idea #1

    - Refrigerants: R600 / R507 / R1150 / R14
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Compressor #1 13.5cc/rev
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
    - R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
    - R600 // R507+R1150+R14 HX R600 / R507
    - R600 R600 back to compressor #1
    - R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
    - R507 TEV
    - R507 // R1150+R14 HX R507 / R1150
    - R507 R507 back to compressor #1
    - R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R1150)
    - R1150 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l
    - R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
    a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
    or
    b) TEV modded for R1150
    - R14 Compressor #2 13.4cc/rev on R14 LSP (preceeded by a hand valve)
    - R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
    - R1150 R1150 back to compressor #1
    - R14 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
    - R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
    - R14 R14 back to compressor #2

    This way, at the end of phase separations, the R14 is stuck into is own area of the circuit by closing hand valves. Then a dedicated compressor is used to make it running. Dunno if it can be done... and if it makes sense.

    Idea #2

    - Refrigerants: R600 / R507 / R1150 / R14
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Compressor #1 13.5cc/rev // Compressor #2 13.4cc/rev
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
    - R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
    - R600 // R507+R1150+R14 HX R600 / R507
    - R600 R600 back to compressors suc side
    - R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
    - R507 TEV
    - R507 // R1150+R14 HX R507 / R1150
    - R507 R507 back to compressors suc side
    - R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R1150)
    - R1150 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l
    - R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
    a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
    or
    b) TEV modded for R1150
    - R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
    - R1150 R1150 back to compressors suc side
    - R14 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
    - R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
    - R14 R14 back to compressors suc side

    Here I'm using 2 compressors in // with basically same specs (one LG and one Toshiba), just because I've them and it would be nice to use them actually thx to their 'relativily' limited power consumption / and noise.

    Idea #3

    - Refrigerants: R600 / R507 / R1150 / R14
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Compressor 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
    - R600+R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
    - R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
    - R600 // R507+R1150+R14 HX R600 / R507
    - R600 R600 back to compressor suc side
    - R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
    - R507 TEV
    - R507 // R1150+R14 HX R507 / R1150
    - R507 R507 back to compressor suc side
    - R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R1150)
    - R1150 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l
    - R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
    a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
    or
    b) TEV modded for R1150
    - R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
    - R1150 R1150 back to compressor suc side
    - R14 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
    - R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
    - R14 R14 back to compressor suc side

    Basically the same idea as #2, but with a single and more powerful compressor to be chosen among moderately powerful to very powferful with the LG NG407 for instance.

    Idea #4

    1st STAGE
    - Refrigerants: R600 / R507 / R1150
    - R600+R507+R1150 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
    - R600+R507+R1150 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R600+R507+R1150 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R600+R507+R1150 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
    - R600+R507+R1150 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
    - R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
    - R600 // R507+R1150 HX R600 / R507
    - R600 R600 back to compressor suc side
    - R507+R1150 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
    - R507 TEV
    - R507 // R1150 HX R507 / R1150
    - R507 R507 back to compressor suc side
    - R1150 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l
    - R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
    a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
    or
    b) TEV modded for R1150
    - R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
    - R1150 R1150 back to compressor suc side

    2nd STAGE
    - Refrigerant: R14
    - R14 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
    - R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
    - R14 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
    - R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
    - R14 R14 back to compressor suc side

    One autocascading stage + a classic single stage.

    Idea #5

    1st STAGE
    - Refrigerants: R600 / R507
    - R600+R507 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
    - R600+R507 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R600+R507 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R600+R507 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
    - R600+R507 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
    - R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
    - R600 // R507 HX R600 / R507
    - R600 R600 back to compressor suc side
    - R507 TEV
    - R507 // R1150 HX R507 / R1150
    - R507 R507 back to compressor suc side

    2nd STAGE
    - Refrigerants: R1150 / R14
    - R1150+R14 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
    - R1150+R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R1150+R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R507 // R1150+R14 HX R507 / R1150
    - R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R1150)
    - R1150 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
    - R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
    a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
    or
    b) TEV modded for R1150
    - R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
    - R1150 R1150 back to compressor suc side
    - R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
    - R14 R14 back to compressor suc side

    Two autocascading stages.

    - 70cm/50cm/85cm case (with an intermediate stage): possibly pvc sides, and caoutchouc wheels.

    Hope it can be done. I'd like to be able to use R1150 or R14 independently.
    Last edited by before; 30-04-2009 at 06:01 PM.



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    France
    Age
    39
    Posts
    88
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: [Autocascade] Only a project ATM

    Well maybe I'm going to make it a little bit differently.

    Here's my new idea.

    Idea #6

    1st STAGE
    - Refrigerants: R507 / R1150
    - R507+R1150 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
    - R507+R1150 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R507+R1150 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R507+R1150 Condenser: Luve 5.2Kw
    - R507+R1150 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
    - R507 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l w/ rotalock valve
    - R507 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a valve -electronic?-):
    a) (this way it will restrict access to R507 only, R1150 is believed to be pushed and stuck in a closed part of the system) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV: Fach PZ1 (flared)
    --- CPU evaporator #1
    --- compressor suc side
    or
    b) TEV
    --- R507 // R1150 HX: 12pl
    --- compressor suc side
    - R1150 liquid reciever: Alco ~1.4l
    - R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a valve -electronic?-):
    a) (only if R507 is set to way 'b') 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV: Fach PZ1 (flared)
    --- CPU evaporator #1
    --- compressor suc side
    or
    b) (only if R507 is set to way 'b') TEV (to be adapted for R1150)
    --- R1150 // R14 HX: 12pl
    --- compressor suc side
    - R507+R1150 Expansion volume: refrigerant tank 2.5l

    2nd STAGE (only if R1150 is set to way 'b')
    - Refrigerants: R14 / R50
    - R14+R50 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
    - R14+R50 Oil separator: ShineYear
    - R14+R50 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
    - R14 // R50 HX: 12pl
    - R14+R50 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R14)
    - R14 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 0.88l
    - R14 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a valve -electronic?-):
    a) (this way it will restrict access to R14 only, R50 is believed to be pushed and stuck in a closed part of the system) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV: Honeywell AEL 1 (brazed)
    --- CPU evaporator #2
    --- compressor suc side
    or
    b) TEV (to be adapted for R14)
    --- R14 // R50 HX: 12pl
    --- compressor suc side
    - R50 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 0.88l
    - R50 A single way for expansion (only if R14 is set to way 'b'):
    --- 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV: Honeywell AEL 1 (brazed)
    --- CPU evaporator #2
    --- compressor suc side
    - R14+R50 Expansion volume: refrigerant tank 2.5l

    Is that make sense?

    I have quite a large choice of compressors to use; don't really know what power the unit will required. I can just use two beefy LG 40.7cc/rev (25,000btu/h) in order to be confident.


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