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Thread: Identify R12 or R134a
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02-09-2008, 08:46 AM #1
Identify R12 or R134a
Is there an easy way to differentiate R12 from R134a in a system WITHOUT a dedicated gas analyser? Thanks in advance for any ideas.
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02-09-2008, 07:09 PM #2
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
Use a halide leak tester
http://www.uniweld.com/catalog/refri...tor_access.htm
Multisync
London
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02-09-2008, 10:20 PM #3
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
It's smell.
Also you could use a slide rule.
ChillinIF AT FIRST YOU DON`T SUCCEED.
DESTROY ALL EVIDENCE THAT YOU TRIED!
and go get a cuppa
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06-09-2008, 04:57 AM #4
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
It's smell.
Okay, that makes sense if they differ in odour, will have to try that and see how good my nose is.
Also you could use a slide rule.
I will take the bait and ask how to differentiate using a slide rule? Will probably wish I had not asked!!
Maybe someone could tell me the difference in flame colour using a Halide tester?
Thanks again.
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06-09-2008, 05:48 AM #5
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06-09-2008, 05:56 AM #6
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Re: Identify R12 or R134a
Turn off questioned unit, force condensation fan to operate, wait some time that suction and discharge pressure is equalized, take reading of air temperature leaving condenser and take reading of pressure at discharge port. Compare that with saturation temperatures of R12 and R134A for that pressure and you will find one what is closely matched. That is your refrigerant in system.
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06-09-2008, 07:24 AM #7
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
The halide torch is a good idea, R12 will turn the flame bright green.
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06-09-2008, 07:42 PM #8
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06-09-2008, 08:33 PM #9
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06-09-2008, 08:46 PM #10
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Re: Identify R12 or R134a
You are right, I was speaking generally and not considering similarity in pressures with R12 and R134A.
Sorry, guys!
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06-09-2008, 10:59 PM #11
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
Sorry my english. Take a little cilinder (rechargable) make vacum, and fill up (no more 70 % water wheigt capacity), with unknows refrigerante ( part liquid) then put a diferent temperatures and take pressures and compare
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06-09-2008, 11:35 PM #12
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
I think Paul and Multisink may have something there.
I a halide torch is NOT affected by R134a. (the flame won't change colour)
Mind you a lot of places get a bit paranoid about the open flame bit!
And check where those fire alarm sensors are.
Better still if relevant Isolate the plant room Alarm
whilst checking.
Grizzly
Just realised you can't buy Halide Torches in U.K. anymore! Or can you?Last edited by Grizzly; 06-09-2008 at 11:37 PM.
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29-09-2008, 07:23 PM #13
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29-09-2008, 08:39 PM #14
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
It's the chlorine which turns the flame green. R134a is Chlorine free is it not?
Multisync
London
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30-09-2008, 08:18 AM #15
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30-09-2008, 05:30 PM #16
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
just thinking out Laud here, if you have a digital manifold and could switch from R12 to R134a, can you not see instantly the difference in the superheat ???
Ice
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30-09-2008, 05:51 PM #17
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30-09-2008, 10:16 PM #18
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01-10-2008, 12:49 PM #19
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
And theres me thinking the C&G training manual would be right
Clearly it is a bit ambigious (sp?), as the one I have only says halide can be used to test for CFC / HCFC without actually naming the gasses.
I've never used halide anyway, got a sniffer instead.
Oh well, live & learn.
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01-10-2008, 04:43 PM #20
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
Voyager...
Fair Play to you.
Your point stands.
Silly me I happened to leave a R134a cylinder valve just cracked open.
Luckily I just happened to have my trusty Halide Torch fired up!
Guess what!
The flame turns a purple green, it's no-where near as an intensive a colour change as say R22 or R12.
But "never the less" it does change.
So your vindicated Voyager......
So it would be inconclusive to test with a Halide torch.
Any other suggestions anyone?
[QUOTE]The open flame is the least of your worries. The resulting combusted gas is TOXIC.[QUOTE]
So is AMMONIA but just the same treated carefully no harm is done!
And at least when you are told that it is Toxic you tend to treat it with some form of respect.
GrizzlyLast edited by Grizzly; 01-10-2008 at 04:48 PM.
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04-11-2008, 02:18 AM #21
Re: Identify R12 or R134a
Thanks for all the comments guys. I am really surprised that what I thought was a simple question has turned out to be such a problem. I have asked about a dozen refrigeration service people the same question and have not had an answer that stood up to scrutiny. I would be real happy to get a definite answer if anyone has any more ideas.
Off topic, I purchased a small "Signal Air Horn" the other day. One of those little things that sit on a small aerosol can. Guess whats in the can??? Yes, R134a!!!! So much for not venting to the atmosphere. Also found cans of "Compressed Air" for blowing out electronic items, full of the same thing.
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