Results 1 to 11 of 11

Thread: Oil Separators

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    India
    Age
    76
    Posts
    1,016
    Rep Power
    13

    Oil Separators



    I would like to know if it is essential to install an Oil Separator for a system with R 22 and an Evaporation Temperature of - 5oC.

    Thank you.



  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    China
    Age
    48
    Posts
    52
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Oil Separators

    it is not essential. to my knowledge ,a refrigeration system with R22 and an evaporating tem of - 15oC.it is essential to use an oil seperator

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    India
    Posts
    7
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: Oil Separators

    The Miscibility of mineral oil with R-22 is not great particularly at low temperatures. But I feel for -5degc Evaporating there is no need for oil separator. If you have an option of POE inplace of mineral oil it will be much better.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    India
    Age
    76
    Posts
    1,016
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Oil Separators

    Could I please have some document so that I can produce the same to the client.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    5,330
    Rep Power
    19

    Re: Oil Separators

    If you are using a screw compressor, oil separators are mandatory Samarjit.

    If a recip. compressor is used I think you are not required to use an oil separator as long as the suction lines are designed properly.
    If all else fails, ask for help.


  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    India
    Age
    76
    Posts
    1,016
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Oil Separators

    These are all reciprocating Semi Hermetic Compressors. I had designed the pipe line with due care and on the basis of the pipe line datas available in the Carrier Handbook. Further there is no oil return problem in any of the compressors, except one. There are in all 6 water cooled condensing units.

    The plant has been operating for the last about a year and there has been no problem. The temperatures and the Humidity are being maintained as per requirement. Now the party has called a technician for undertaking the maintenence of the plants. He has told them that the plant should have Oil Separators. Further we had put PHEs as Condensers. The technician says that these are meant for dairies and that we should have put Shell & Tube Condensers.

    The problem is that although the plants are running properly and the customer is more than satisfied with the performance, but the technician who does not appear to be a person well versed in refrigeration has made some comments which the client is believing more than our comments. These are the biggest troubles we have here. These technicians here in our country do not need and basic qualifications to start working on refrigeration plants. Gradually over the years they will be known as engineers and start taking up designing and projects.

    With best wishes and a Happy & a Prosperoud New Year,
    Last edited by Samarjit Sen; 04-01-2008 at 07:00 AM.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Adelaide Australia
    Age
    63
    Posts
    538
    Rep Power
    17

    Re: Oil Separators

    Samarjit Sen
    We have used PHE's as condensers on NH3 plants with no problems as long as the cooling water is kept clean and the strainers are adequate.
    With R22 at chilller duty there is no need to have oil separators. All the Carrier water chillers on R22 that I have worked on don't have any and these chillers don't have problems with oil return. Once the oil / refrigerant mix is right the oil moves around the system with no problems.
    It sounds like the technician has nothing to do and is trying to get some extra work.
    If the client wants proof show him some schematics of Carrier chillers.
    Paul

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Croatia
    Age
    62
    Posts
    2,121
    Rep Power
    23

    Re: Oil Separators

    Hi, Samarjit Sen

    Quote Originally Posted by Samarjit Sen View Post

    The plant has been operating for the last about a year and there has been no problem. The temperatures and the Humidity are being maintained as per requirement. Now the party has called a technician for undertaking the maintenence of the plants. He has told them that the plant should have Oil Separators. Further we had put PHEs as Condensers. The technician says that these are meant for dairies and that we should have put Shell & Tube Condensers.

    The problem is that although the plants are running properly and the customer is more than satisfied with the performance, but the technician who does not appear to be a person well versed in refrigeration has made some comments which the client is believing more than our comments. These are the biggest troubles we have here. These technicians here in our country do not need and basic qualifications to start working on refrigeration plants. Gradually over the years they will be known as engineers and start taking up designing and projects.
    Sounds like a SF story, unfortunately it is true....Not easy to suggest you what to do except to stand behind your project design....seems he would like to make some extra money...

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulZ
    It sounds like the technician has nothing to do and is trying to get some extra work.
    If the client wants proof show him some schematics of Carrier chillers.
    You are a smart man and you can handle the guys like him

    Best regards, Josip

    It's impossible to make anything foolproof because fools are so ingenious...

    Don't ever underestimate the power of stupid people when they are in large groups.

    Please, don't teach me how to be stupid....
    No job is as important as to jeopardize the safety of you or those that you work with.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    malaysia
    Posts
    159
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: Oil Separators

    Hola Samarjit,

    i believe
    1] screw comp need oil sep;
    2] piston comp varies in accordance with design.

    i've designed psiton comp package unit without oil sep and it still works fine.

    but, to me most multiple comp in centralised system need oil sep & tank to re-distribute lube oil to each comp, esp. when lead-lag ctrls to comp occurs.

    i don't know which version of carrier handbook you seek reference but it would be better to review more than 1 reference/s.

    yes, on the piping design, i wonder you have also consider the pressure losses over pipe fittings and valves ...

    there are many factors within the piping system which could induce velocity losses in lube oil travelling during its balancing cycle. i also take deep considerations on equal distribution in centralised piping.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    India
    Age
    76
    Posts
    1,016
    Rep Power
    13

    Re: Oil Separators

    Hello Hendry,

    I was referring to the Carrier Handbook of System Design. Although I have some more reference books and references for refrigeration piping, I have always preferred this particular Handbbook.

    The systems are all independent and there is no problem as such. The required conditions are being maintained properly and the client is satisfied with the performance. It is just that a technician has advised them certain modifications and requirements.
    and unfortunately the owner has been greatly infuenced by the so called engineer.

    This is the first time that such a thing has happened to me and I felt very bad about the same. As I feel that if I share my experience and my tragidy like this with you all in the forum, I shall feel not greatly relieved but will gain some knowledge if by any chance there has been an error on my part.

    For all of us this Forum is a great place to share and give. From the comments recieved by my freinds , I am greatly relieved and am more in peace.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    malaysia
    Posts
    159
    Rep Power
    11

    Smile Re: Oil Separators

    well, friends [sometimes foes] are blessings to us.

    i think i have the same book when i was in building jobs. [have to dig the old boxes to find it ...] i still remember most consultants will have one in their drawer. they refer nothing but this for air cond design those days ...

    agreed, some client's maintenance team just not the right stuff for the jobs but yet blow big horns ...

Similar Threads

  1. R-508B oil return problems
    By Hank Hill in forum Industrial
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 05-02-2010, 06:58 PM
  2. Parker levels in ammonia systems
    By Friobernal in forum Industrial
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 04-08-2005, 03:46 PM
  3. Oil systems
    By bernard in forum Supermarket Refrigeration
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 04-04-2005, 10:04 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •