PDA

View Full Version : Is This Legal



aza
19-07-2007, 05:55 PM
Hello All,

I have recently been servicing a/c units and lots of Condensers have installed INDOORS ie, small warehouse units.

Today I was asked the Question

is it legal to have these outdoor units, indoors??

does anyone know the ANSWER??

The Viking
19-07-2007, 06:43 PM
Yes, it is legal

US Iceman
19-07-2007, 06:45 PM
I would think a more important question is why are the units being installed indoors? The heat the condensing units reject to the interior space has to be ventilated to the outdoors. Eventually the air temperature will increase and this affects the system performance badly.

The Viking
19-07-2007, 08:17 PM
Why oh why?
It is a good question but unfortunately so isn't the answer very satisfying.......

Here in UK most business properties are leased, in the agreement is normally a clause letting the tenant do whatever they like with the internal parts of the building (but they agree to put it back to as it was when they leave, or pay the landlord to do so). But in the same standard contract is stated that "no alterations what so ever" is allowed to the outside of the building without land lord's written agreement and planning permission.

Thus, it is easier and quicker to use the warehouse.

US Iceman
19-07-2007, 08:30 PM
Makes sense in an odd sort of way.

The Viking
19-07-2007, 10:17 PM
Makes sense in an odd sort of way.

US I,

Bear in mind that this is in a country where there is no maximum working temperature for us humans.
In theory, an UK employee still has to work after the water boiled of from the glass on his desk and the keyboard melted.

This is an odd place..........
;)

Abe
20-07-2007, 09:30 AM
We installed a very small, 2.5Kw outdoor in a garage the other day.

The reason:

The householder said burglars will think shes rich and target her house if they saw the unit.

Also planning is a big issue. Another thing, a lot of people think its unsightly and affects the aesthetics of the environment and general look in relation to other properties.


I located in the garage on the strict understanding that proper ventilation is provided for and that the heat generated is expelled to minimise drop in performance and also prevent rise in head pressures.

There are doors and windows to the side of the garage, and these can be opened at times of high temps.

Saying that, I am not in favour of locating condensers within confines, outdoor means, outdoor........

Argus
20-07-2007, 10:32 AM
.

There’s nothing illegal about installing any part of a refrigeration or air conditioning system indoors either in or out of a plant room, but the question should be, is it wise and what are the considerations?

If the unit is intended to be installed in a ventilated plant room or indoors (and some are) all well and good; in many instances, aesthetics or planning laws prevent outside installation. Supermarkets do this all the time. Outdoor units are always intended to go outside. If you install it inside you have to accept a compromise on reliability in use and a probability that the manufacturer may void a warranty.

However where there are other considerations:

Never install any system in a plant room or other location where there is an unbalanced boiler intake; in other words where the air to the boiler is taken from the same indoor location. Refrigerant leakage can produce lethal mixtures in a boiler.

Next, in any case, don’t ignore COSHH or advising the client of the presence of the system so he can assess it as he has to do by law.

Finally, in the UK and the EU, there are safety guides and restrictions (often ignored, but they do exist) on installing any part of a DX refrigeration or air conditioning system in a ‘human occupied space’. Read the guides and limits in the relevant Safety standard, EN 378.


.

paul_h
20-07-2007, 10:43 AM
It's common here to put commercial units in ceiling spaces. One commercial centre has about 6 cabinet and coolroom condensers, and about 10 split system condensers in it. Requires massive exhaust fans to work, and even then it's 10K above ambient in there.

But it's for the same reason, the management running the place don't want condenser units everywhere outside, and the roof is a tiled saw tooth shape no there's nowhere on the roof to put them out of sight.

In the beginning there was only the refrig stuff in there. Then all the shops added airconditioning later, so off course everything broke down as it was 30K above ambient in there, about 60C.
It took a lot of hassling by us to get the management to get the ehaust fans in.

old gas bottle
20-07-2007, 05:46 PM
or there is the plain old reason,COST !, we have lost countless jobs where the ideal location for the outdoor unit involves a lengthy or awkward pipe run,you quote on doing the right thing then someone gets the job by slinging in a back to back, now that is common and with no thought at all of servicing after warrenty.

Richard Hillsid
22-09-2007, 08:14 PM
Humane reson 2 !

I have done a few indoors installations in factory plants where heat is extreme and the break rooms are at over 35 C at any given time. I have used the basic robust industry machines for this, dont like doing it but sometimes the break room a “40 ' container” with a coffee machine is way beyond 50 meters from a wall and the ceiling is 30 meters up (no way im going to do that pump down up ****.) but the employees need a cool spot to take a break and sure love you, eaven when you meet one of work at downtown ;)