How much do you Charge? [Archive] - Refrigeration-Engineer.com forums

Rtic

15-12-2006, 11:48 PM

Just wondering what other Refrigeration Engineers charge customers. The reason why I ask is because I am posting on these forums for my father, (he is a very experienced and knowledgeable refrigeration engineer at the young age of 65 but doesn’t know too much about computers so I do much of the online work) and I think that he charges to low, although because I don't many Refrigeration engineers (just me and me pops). My Dad Charges as Follows: -

- 30 pound an Hour

- NO CALL OUT CHARGE
- Most parts that he will use he will add on about 20 pound for himself
- Every time he uses any gas he will add 5pound to the bill
- 1 year Guarantee for any work that he does (his a nice guy!)

Any feedback much appreciated!

Brian_UK

16-12-2006, 12:14 AM

As you classify yourself as "The Best Refrigeration Engineer" I suppose you must be in the top band above your father.

Rtic

16-12-2006, 02:13 AM

I don't and won't ever classify myself a better engineer in any cattery as my dad. He has done alot in his life, been all around the world (including doing refrigeration for royalty) but also knows everything to do with pluming, electricity and so on. A few years ago he invested all his money in a run down building, and by himself he built up one of the most wonderful Hotel (Granton House Hotel in Moffat, Scotland) which sadly burnt down in 1997. I only hope that one day I will be as good as him. I will change my profile now as I am not the greatest refrigeration engineer. In fact there maybe 100s of people that are better at be a refrigeration engineer. I just hope that in the years to come I will be as good as you guys.

LRAC

16-12-2006, 08:23 AM

Just wondering what other Refrigeration Engineers charge customers.

Hi Rtic

The question you've asked is not straight forward, alot of factors go towards making up the final price you charge customers.
You need to decide if your going to keep the company small or hopefully employ people in the future. Are you looking too just make a living during the 40 hour week, i would look at all of your overheads for a full year i.e mortgage,vehicle,wages etc, devide these by the number of working days per year excluding weekends and bank holidays.Also remember depreciation on vehicles and Mr. Taxman and even worse than the Taxman is Mr. robbing accountant.

Phone around other refrigeration companies in your area who work in the same sector and ask what they charge, you can then decide whether to under cut these prices and it should give you a good idea were to start your campaign.

Contact your suppliers and try to gain better discounts on spares and refrigerant and as Tesco says " every little helps".

Forum members may be able to help on labour charges but this depends on location no good with London rates if your in the middle of wales.Start at the beginning with simple overhead calculations and you can't go wrong unless you get too gready.

Remember if you dont charge a callout fee you could end up travelling for 4 hours per day only leaving 4 hours of chargable work.

Most companies in the midlands charge an attendance fee of £ 75 to include the first hours labour.

Good luck
Lrac

Servicefrigo

16-12-2006, 03:58 PM

Hy all;
It's been a wille since I didn't post at this forrum,but I thinck it's a interesting subject.
10-15 euro/ h in Romania.
I don't now how will be when we will be members of E.C.

Rtic

16-12-2006, 04:51 PM

Hi LRAC - Thanks for some of the Info you have given me. It's helped me understand a bit more about what my Dad should charge. I went to business School for 3 years and Know a bit about researching the Market, and I thought I should start here. In the area where we work there are very few Refrigeration Engineers, and all the refrigeration company's use us so we can't compare our Pricing. I'm going to get him to start charging a call out charge as I think he is loosing a lot of money (as he is on the road a lot) and I think that customers will understand. I want him to raise how much he charges a hour (in fact I want him to charge at least £30 a hour) but he is intent in his opinion that customers won't like it. He has the valid point that he is established in this area and customers who use him regularly will question the rise. Although I have tried to explain that If they search elsewhere I would doubt they would find much cheaper.

Hi Servicefrigo - I am amazed how little you are able to charge in Romania. It makes my dads charging seem like highway robbery! I suspect that living over there is much cheaper though. What do you mean by the E.C? Do you mean the EU?

Abe

16-12-2006, 06:12 PM

Hi LRAC -
He has the valid point that he is established in this area and customers who use him regularly will question the rise. Although I have tried to explain that If they search elsewhere I would doubt they would find much cheaper.

Rtic

I know youve come in with your high tech computers and spreadsheets, but dont rock the boat too much.
:)

Remember, your dad is from old school and set in his ways. He has established clientelle who are used to him and his work.

Drastically altering conditions with established customers wont go down too good. The adage, start the way you wish to continue is appropriate here.

As LRAC says, its a simple costing assessment. Weigh up your business costs, overheads, etc, divide by number of hours worked and you reach a breakeven point.

You now add your profit margin and this is your hourly rate. It will differ from area to area, London rates for instance will vary from what you can charge in Scotland.

Hi Servicefrigo - I am amazed how little you are able to charge in Romania. It makes my dads charging seem like highway robbery! I suspect that living over there is much cheaper though. What do you mean by the E.C? Do you mean the EU?

Why are you surprised and amazed?

The two economies of Britain and Romania are different and the charges reflect this.

EC stands for European Community. There is no EU, which is short for European Union. It was originally EEC but since both political and economic union, shortened to EC.

Good luck with your sweeping brush, but as I say , dont rock the boat too much.

:)

Rtic

16-12-2006, 07:37 PM

Hi Abe - I am only young and I understand that I have a lot to learn:). I understand My Dad is old school and I see where you are coming from. BUT my Dad himself does recognize that he charges to little - OK heres the story - in 1997 the hotel my dad had in Scotland burnt down and lost all previous Refrigeration tools. He didn't (or as of yet:mad:) receive any insurance money. We moved to Lincolnshire and he had to start off a business with a small budget and had to attract customers by charging them very little. Now we are an established business but still charging too little. Now both me and my Dad want to sort out the financing of the business, and in business school I was taught to start off with research. I started off here and so far I've been given some good advise -THANKS!:D. I have listened to your advise (Abe & LRAC) and I have decided (before any changes in what we charge the customer) to get together our financial records and do as you suggested by plotting out a break-even graph (see I did learn something in business school!:rolleyes:).

Thanks also on the info on EC - I always thought it was called the EU, as I say I am always willing to learn:).

Abe

16-12-2006, 09:44 PM

Rtic

Thank you for your honesty. I am glad you are thinking of your dads business, and ok, Ill be more then willing to help and advise you, ok.

You say he did not receive any insurance money, is this still in abeyance, or is Insurance company not paying?

Please keep posting. Dont be put off. Start off, tell me what your dad is charging at moment. If you dont feel comfortable about certain things, you can send me a private message.

Hope to hear from you

Abe

Rtic

17-12-2006, 12:14 AM

Thanks Abe:). We are still fighting the insurance company for the money (which in it's self is costing an arm and a leg:rolleyes:). At the moment my dad charges 20 pound a Hour. In the next week I'm going to put together a Break Even graph a and a balance sheet to see what I can make of the company's current finances.

BTW Abe - I will keep posting!:) I love this website, I am really into refrigeration and hope to be as good as my dad one day;).

chillin out

17-12-2006, 12:42 AM

I would say make him charge at least £30.

Now that you are in the company there is more expense to pay out, plus if he is as good as you say he is then his/your customers wont mind the increase. It may even make them take out a maint contract with you which would give you a better idea of your financial year outlook.

Chillin:) :)

Servicefrigo

17-12-2006, 09:08 AM

Hy
I must make some specifications
10-15 euro/h /technicians ,begining when i start my van
So let's supose the entire work will took 4 hours and the driving time to the coustomer and back to office will be 2 4 + 2 x 2 techs. = 120 euro
Always the team is made from at least 2 tech's
Spare parts changed = acquisition price+20%
So in this case I thinck is not so cheap that apears at the first look
Regards

jsimon

30-12-2006, 10:01 PM

What it comes down to in the end is if you are working alone or as a team 2= 1\2 the profit margin
20 per hour is fine on a 40 hour week for 1 man being chargable ? what about travelling time and expences parking time to collect parts time doing quotes and evenings doing the invoicing vat etc etc

coolflow

31-12-2006, 09:17 AM

hi i live in spain on the costa del sol and charge €50/kg for R22 and others at 55€ the labour is 25€ p/h and have no problems with it.

Contactor

17-08-2007, 09:46 PM

I stay away from fixed rates , standard call out charges etc.. I find that it is best to take each customer / job on its merits.

ckone180

22-08-2007, 02:18 AM

You guys in the UK are pretty cheap, huh? Europe is high from my view (holidays). We charge a great deal more here, somewhere closer to $85/hr and a service charge. Seems to be closer to 40-42 Euro.

Lowrider

22-08-2007, 10:08 PM

one us dollar is 0,74 euro!

So $85 is 62,9 euro! That's about right in Holland if you leave out the tax!

ckone180

23-08-2007, 03:29 AM

one us dollar is 0,74 euro!

So $85 is 62,9 euro! That's about right in Holland if you leave out the tax!

You have the exchange rate, damn, it was really late when posted, still though, that is average for us.

Lowrider

23-08-2007, 09:56 PM

Even I know how to search the net for it!

(For some more info, tax in Holland is 19%) Might be useless info, but hey one never knows!

ckone180

24-08-2007, 01:47 AM

Even I know how to search the net for it!

(For some more info, tax in Holland is 19%) Might be useless info, but hey one never knows!
I wasn't being a smartass, just joking.....:D

Lowrider

24-08-2007, 08:56 PM

I wasn't being a smartass, just joking.....

Me too! (even if I like to get things right!)

koy

26-08-2007, 09:19 PM

I charge 100€ for any small single split (1 kg) Larger systems + multis splits I add accordingly, depending on witch gas the system is, this includes call out plus I make sure the leak is fixed. Here in, Spain, to many noobs think its ok to recharge systems without fixing the leak first, I charge 70€ on call outs within a distance if it gose over the distance I would normaly travle then I add accordingly depending on weather I know what the job is worth or if I want it. ;)

PS. Thats for cash if theirs no factura, if I have to pressent a factura (bill) then add extra 16%

techguy

07-09-2007, 03:13 PM

Hi RTC,

As most of the guys have pointed out you should keep your hourly rate competetive. Keep it in line with the local competetion.

Where you have room for cost increase is on parts and Ref gas. Your customers can check the cost of labour locally however they will not have an Idea about the costy of parts or gas.

Don't rip them off but at least add a good % on to the cost of the part and any travel costs incured or time taken to collect the part. Bottom line don't do anything for nothing you have a skill that people should pay for
don't sell yourself cheap.

Best of luck with the buisness

T

paul_h

07-09-2007, 03:28 PM

Here I have to charge au$90 callout fee, plus $90 p/hr. Both are +10% tax, so $99/$99. The callout fee includes 15min labour for simple diagnostics.
Some people are surprised as others (self employed or small operations) charge less, but most are willing to pay that in the end for someone who knows what they are doing. There's no shortage of customers, some refered directly, some come to us after trying other people who didn't know what they were doing.
I myself plan to charge maybe au$50 callout fee (no labour included, but will just charge them that on 5 min jobs), and au$80 per hour labour

Rtic

16-09-2007, 12:57 PM

It's a real surprise how much charging varies in refrigeration; I suppose that refrigeration is a specialist job and should be charging 35/hr upwards, but try telling my dad that! Some people have a real kind streak, I mean last week we done a one off job (we don't usually do domestics) fitting a stat to a old ladies fridge, real hard bugger took 45 minutes, should of cost her £52.50 but you should of seen her - on her last legs, offering us tea and chocolates every 5 minutes - we gave her it for free! We're just to kind!

I tell you these old ladies will send me bankrupt!

PaulZ

16-10-2007, 12:37 AM

Hi Rtic
As stated by others you probably want to find out what the going rate is in your area. Paul h is right if you do a good job and know what you are doing most customers don't mind paying the higher rate.
Refrigeration is a specialist trade and if you compare what we charge to say a photocopier of computer tech we are a lot less in most cases (companies we deal with anyway). You also need to increase your rates on a regular basis as your costs go up each year, wages, fuel, operating expenses. Some customers will go elswhere if you put your rates up but usually these are the ones that argue about the bill anyway. These customers will always look for the cheapest not the best.

RAZVAN MILITARU

02-11-2007, 08:17 PM

you will be...trust me...

markacs

11-11-2007, 07:23 AM

My Rates In Rural South Africa:

Normally Depends On The Client.

Normal Rates:r200,00 P/h

Bad Payers:r280,00p/h

Jobs That Have Been Worked On By The Local Bush Mechanic And Havent Been Fixed Correctly
R400,00 P/h.

Suta Eugen

16-11-2007, 12:07 PM

Situation is changing also in Romania ,price per hour its around 15 ..25 Euro / h with out taxes.

Suta Eugen

16-11-2007, 12:11 PM

you will be...trust me...

Buna ziua Razvan !

Cum este viata in UK ?

REEFER-TEK

29-11-2007, 05:13 PM

REEFER-TEK

29-11-2007, 05:22 PM

You guys in the UK are pretty cheap, huh? Europe is high from my view (holidays). We charge a great deal more here, somewhere closer to $85/hr and a service charge. Seems to be closer to 40-42 Euro.

It all sounds cheap to me Transpport guys can charge 100+ an hr all day long in the US

paul_h

29-11-2007, 05:34 PM

I've just done a few jobs working under my own company.
Still working for my regular employer, who charges au$90 callout + 10% tax, and au$90 p/hr labour + 10% tax.
I'm charging au$80 callout and au$80 p/hr labour, no tax as you don't need to charge GST unless you turnover au$75000 a year.
The customers I've dealt with so far didn't bat an eyelid, most people charge more, most people don't know what they're doing with modern splits. They just wanted someone ASAP and would pay for it, I happen to know what I'm talking about being an ex factory warranty repairer.
Total time I spent going to, from and repairs was 1.25hr, total money in my pocket was au$120, way better than my employer gives me :)
Not to mention the tax write offs ;)
whats that in your language? 40 pounds an hour for fixing a split in someone house worth 200 pounds?

richardb14

08-02-2008, 09:43 PM

£60 per hour

chillin out

09-02-2008, 01:48 AM

£60 per hour
Any jobs going at your place?

What line of refrigeration are you in?

Chillin:):)

richardb14

09-02-2008, 04:30 PM

Any jobs going at your place?

What line of refrigeration are you in?

Chillin:):)

we do Ultra low temp, -80 and -150, we also do temperature mapping and validation - that's £100 an hour :D

we still do run of the mill stuff as well - but the basic rate is £40 per hour. call out charge is £40 per hour plus 25p per mile.

it's funny as most jobs are priced as to how much it would cost to replace an item of equipment, like a 2nd stage on a ult will use an sc21, this will cost around £1200 to fix, whereas the same compressor on a 2 door freezer will cost about £500 to change :confused:

jdunc2301

05-04-2008, 03:29 PM

£42ph
no call out
if you need us to travel for 2 hrs to the job its two hrs labor plus time on site and travel home!
if your local it may only be one hour travel, we dont charge if we get stuck in traffic we go by the route planner on the net lol
:D all parts extra incl evp fan motors etc and even crimps and ties are charged out! we get called expensive but we dont have recalls so people pay up :)

icecube51

22-06-2008, 01:29 PM

i now its a bit late to answer this question, but in mi opinion we have to look in what country we are in first.

i suspect the price for bread is not the same in Belgium as it is in India....
also the housing, renting or baying, electric, cars , fuel ,tools ,clothing en so on.

we have to compare apples whit apples.;)

Ice

nevgee

23-06-2008, 01:12 AM

WE charge £35 /hr iclusive of milage but, we have contrators who charge £45 /hr
Our minimum charge is £70 which allows for the first 1/2 hr on site.
In view of recent fuel cost rises we think it may be time to charge for milage ...£0.25 /mile?
a typical van at 35 mpg is about 15p /mile fuel only!

icecube51

25-06-2008, 08:52 AM

i charge 27€ for transport,in a range of 60 km, and 57€/hour. if a job is not done because of mi one stupidity, i can not fix it because i don't now how,the don't pay.:o
and if i have to do a job after the cowboys , i work as slow as possible, and change as much spare parts as i can,:eek:
just to prove there not cheaper of whit local cowboys.

Ice