Cowboy stuffup

[Cary]

I am sure we have all been called on to fix someone elses mistake hey Im not perfect I think I made one my self once.
The thing is how should you react to a job that was either a self install or a very bad cowboy.
The job in question I was called in on a warranty claim for a Heller 8.4 kW crapbox. It was not heating, so I turned it to cooling mode and the compressor was cycling. I grabbed a guage set to put on and the customer told me its only been installed for 8 months it should be right for gas.
Yes I said it should but its not. The system was running in vacuum.
I pressure charged it with a sniff of 22 and 100psi of nitrogen and found a leak behind the head.
At this stage considering the pipe work was not enclosed in dust and the wall entrance was not weather or vermine proofed I informed the customer that it may not be a warranty claim is he happy to proceed if he has to pay and he agreed.

On pulling the head off the wall I found both flare nuts leaking. Both nuts were tight, so I undid them, cut the flares off them and reflared them. The the pipes did not feel right - too stiff. This is when the customer informed me "that's what the last guy did". I reflared the pipes, reconnected and pressure checked it to find another major leak in the wall cavity. The customer then informed me that there was an "elbow" welded in there. At this stage I informed him that the elbows were water grade not refrigerant grade and I then twigged that all copper was not annealed refrigerant grade and that's why it was stiff.

The customer said he had trouble purchasing 5/8 3/8 copper and could only source it from one outlet - he had supplied the tube and had a nebulous refrigeration mechanic do the install - name or receipt never to be located, he managed to drag up a name for this person - however it was MINE!!! I told him that was me and I did not do the original installation, or repair.

After cutting out the welds in the wall cavity I found two york presolded elbows soldered with soft lead - very badly and a major leak. I repaired the system, evacuated and recharged - all's going well.

As the customer has advised that another refrigeration engineer (name remains lost - now that's two in a row) recharged the air/con previously and charged for the 3kg of R22 without fixing the leak.

If you were in my situation - how would you charge the guy???

[US Iceman]

You should charge him for your work. You are entitled to be paid for all of your assistance and material.


name or receipt never to be located, he managed to drag up a name for this person - however it was MINE!!! I told him that was me and I did not do the original installation, or repair.

:eek:

This is unusual. If you did not do the original installation, someone is operating under your name. Was the other guy paid in cash?

If I were you I would try to find out who this character is!

[Andy W]

If it was water pipe and yorkshire fittings, did you rip it all out and repipe it, if not I certainly would not of regassed it.

[NoNickName]

I receive daily phone calls for units sold under our brand name that do not fall under any of our products.
I'm not surprised. There must be batches of stickers around.

[S_Line]

sounds like you have been called out to a nightmare install :(

Problem now lies with you, if you have now fixed the bad bit, and re gassed and re charged, if any other problem occurred with the pipework the customer will call you up and say " hey but you repaired it and recharged it"

There come a point where we have to stand our ground and say ! Sorry but its got to be all re installed !

Its down to the engineer to say that the previous work is satisfactory as the new engineer has now taken over the service.. etc....

[Cary]

Yes I did replace the faulty york elbows and soft lead solder as I was able to show him the nitrogen leaking out but was unable to convince him of a full re pipeing of the job.I explained that it was a repair only and I could not be held responsible for any faults in the future
I also found out that some other fridgie (again unable to remember who)had previously reflared the ends and recharged the unit how he did not find the leaking elbow has got me wet you could hear it.
So in the period of 8 months the unit was charged twice I charged $250 apparently the other guy charged $260 .
So much for saving money by breaking the law and voiding warrenty and he still has a crappy job that I would not put my name to.

[US Iceman]

...and he still has a crappy job that I would not put my name to

You might not put your name to it, but the customer might. If the customer would not let you repair the project correctly, I would have walked away.

Even though you told him this was essentially done at his direction, this will be forgotten the next time he calls back.

Or even worse, he calls someone else and uses your name.:(

[Andy T]

Cary, I feel for you, and I would have done the same to fix the problems as you described.In an effort to help the poor chap out, and try to gain the confidence of the customer that not all engineers are bad.Rather than walk away as if to gloat over the customers problems or make the customer feel as if you are suckering him out of even more money. But you have got to be aware that, by the repair you are putting your name to any future problems the system may have.However the blame reduces the longer the system stay fault free.This is the case even on good systems.As long as the next engineer says who the hell put this in. Rather than who was the last person to work on this, you will be fine.

[iceman007]

Charge to re-install it again properly. If he exects you to mess with a bad installation, then I would walk away from it. To cover yourself, put it in writing, and add a clause that you WILL NOT WARRANTY THE SYSTEMS OPERATION. If the original installationis that poor, then you just don't know how much damage has already been caused to the components. I would only warranty my own work, not the parts. And get at least 50% upfront to cever your costs, because I've been in a similar situation and then 3 weeks down the line, the compressor fails, and you have problems getting paid.

Good Luck
James

[Makeit go Right]

I guess I'm a little late here, and the thing is well and truly done and dusted.

I can see how the thin edge of the wedge draws one into the mess, first it's just the flares, and then....the lid starts to come off the can of worms. And without standing back to take a broad look at things, you wind up committed now, with the promise that you would fix the system. And the integrity drains away, more and more, with every minute. (And, shall I just grab the tools and making a dash for it?)

At this point, having done your best and got the thing running, even though (with hindsight) you should have made a stop at one point and told him, "Wait a minute! This system is just a bodge, and the further I go the worse it looks. I can't do any more repairing, the pipework has to come out and a new CORRECT installation has to go in!" Well, that's with hindsight and one's integrity back in sharp and proud condition again.

Okay, at home, how much do you charge? Well, that's up to you and your rates etc. But, more importantly, you need to state some arse-covering stuff on that invoice. Like "Emergency Temporary Repairs." and in big CAP letters underneath that, somewhere: THE ORIGINAL SYSTEM IS TOTALLY UNSATISFACTORY AND THE PIPEWORK SYSTEM MUST BE REPLACED WITH NEW QUALITY REFRIGERATION PIPE AND FITTINGS ETC WITHIN THE NEXT 2 WEEKS."

Something like that, so that you do not carry the can for practically certifying the installation as adequate/satisfactory. Maybe also explain it to him that you have done the emergency repair to get it running for the moment, as he was in a spot, but he really must get it reinstalled.

And give him a quote for the repair, mentioning again that the emergency repairs were temporary only, and only okay for the next 2 weeks (though that is rather generous).

I'm sure you will do better next time, eh?