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View Full Version : what will happen to vrv units once r410a etc is banned







abp32
26-10-2016, 08:41 PM
hi there

what are your thoughts on how vrvs are going to get on in the future .
and what are you using instead of r404a we are trying out r407a/f but it's coming back to the pot 13c hotter than 404a and with its gwp it's going to get the chop as well probably

cadwaladr
27-10-2016, 12:22 AM
410a? Seems to be where it's heading

Rob White
27-10-2016, 07:42 AM
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R32?

Rob

.

charlie patt
27-10-2016, 09:26 PM
All the 4 gases are to high g w p but 32 is slightly flammable so surely can't be used on vrv as what happens when a flare leeks and fills the room with flammable gas ???? What's left???? Water or back to lots of splits

frank
28-10-2016, 05:48 AM
I've heard that Daikin are testing co2 vrv in Japan at the moment before bringing it to market

Grizzly
28-10-2016, 06:30 AM
Hi Frank.C
Can you use copper pipe on co2, given the pressures involved.

Grizzly

Rob White
28-10-2016, 11:26 PM
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Suppermarkets do but they are thick walled, heavy and have steel
alloys inside to take the pressure. Certainly not flexable.

Rob

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Rob White
28-10-2016, 11:28 PM
All the 4 gases are to high g w p but 32 is slightly flammable so surely can't be used on vrv as what happens when a flare leeks and fills the room with flammable gas ???? What's left???? Water or back to lots of splits

R410 is 50% R32 and Daikin are driving it hard for splits.

Rob

.

cadwaladr
29-10-2016, 03:14 AM
Transport units are adopting 410a,well that's the type coming out of Japan by mhi?

charlie patt
29-10-2016, 09:38 PM
But it's gwp is to high for what has been set if we stick to our incoming requirements 410 will be banned or am I reading it wrong

hookster
30-10-2016, 10:41 AM
As an industry we brought this all on ourselves in my opinion, we tried to treat the sympton not the cause.
The sympton was the destruction of the ozone layer and high GWP from released gasses.
The cause is the release of the refrigerant and not the actual refrigerant itself as there are a lot more hazardous compounds around that do not get banned.

Our refrigerant systems fail more on design than on any other aspect, VRF / VRV systems are a prime example for bad manufacture (yes every single manufacturer) take your hand and shake the condensing coil they move and therefore will fail. The construction is flimsy and mass produced. They fail after the maximum life span I have seen on any being only 15 years (you will be lucky to get this) We have replaced failed systems only 5 years old.

The design of a refrigeration system could be improved and made leak free i.e pipe in pipe etc.
All good design does is cut into profit margins and make items more a luxury item, which is exactly what airconditioning is!
Running an airconditioning unit then uses electricity which creates further GWP in its production. As humans we take our comfort over our planet and don't realise that short term comfort will affect our long term comfort.

Magoo
12-11-2016, 11:15 PM
Hello Hookster.
totally agree with all comments in your post. Everything is driven by maximizing profit, and total disregard for environment.

MikeHolm
13-11-2016, 12:16 PM
R410 is in almost everything here and the word is that it will be gone in a few years so........