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reefermadness
15-04-2006, 06:07 PM
Has anyone had anything to do with these reefers?? They are starting to show up in western canada now. I have hit the website and i'm impressed with the BTU ratings for these units. The body jobs are the only ones that i have seem in real life. Any information about them would be greatly apprieciated.

Reefermadness

thermo690
15-04-2006, 08:25 PM
Has anyone had anything to do with these reefers?? They are starting to show up in western canada now. I have hit the website and i'm impressed with the BTU ratings for these units. The body jobs are the only ones that i have seem in real life. Any information about them would be greatly apprieciated.

Reefermadness

well the latest news on Zanotti UK is that they have gone bust..................The main service contracts have gone to Carrier and Michael Wards.........The factory in Italy will be selling direct in to the UK:(

Reefermadness I sent you a pm

djbe
16-04-2006, 09:53 PM
well the latest news on Zanotti UK is that they have gone bust..................

No surprise there then, based on who was involved running the U.K operation. :D :D

Reeferjon
18-04-2006, 08:09 AM
:eek: :rolleyes:

piaget
19-04-2006, 08:55 AM
Does Zanotti manufacture refrigeration units for airline catering? How does this match up with Thermo King units?

thermo690
23-04-2006, 05:49 PM
Has anyone had anything to do with these reefers?? They are starting to show up in western Canada now. I have hit the website and I'm impressed with the BTU ratings for these units. The body jobs are the only ones that i have seem in real life. Any information about them would be greatly appreciated.

Reefermadness


Hi m8 I've brunt the DVD and it'll be in the post tomorrow.
I've added a bit more info, so have fun.;)

Martin:)

ZSPA
06-10-2006, 04:19 PM
Zanotti Transport Refrigeration was going bust, but Zanotti UK is the new company 100% from Italy distributing Zanotti:):):)

ZSPA
06-10-2006, 04:20 PM
Hi m8 I've brunt the DVD and it'll be in the post tomorrow.
I've added a bit more info, so have fun.;)

Martin:)
if you need info about Zanotti I will send you evevrything

reefermadness
07-10-2006, 02:23 AM
Well, i have finally had a little something to do with the Zanotti brand. They have left a bad taste in my mouth. In Canada, they chose to distribute everything through Montreal. There is a little problem with that. All literature is in French!! The parts manuals, maintance manuals and everything else is just plain sad. As far as the actual reefers themselves..... great when their running.... never ending electrical problems.... poor controllers.... can't make the cold weather....

Perhaps i just got some bad luck.. I have had most to do with Perkins powered 465, 495 body jobs. I have seen the CDN prototype of the nose mount reefer.... nothing impressive yet. They don't even have Zanotti belts!! We have to use jobber on them.

Anywho, if anyone has any thoughts, please let me know.

ReeferMadness

PS: i think i need a mint?:mad:

NoNickName
07-10-2006, 12:09 PM
A bit off topic, but who is the actual purchaser of reefer condensing units? The truck trailer producers?

alpha
13-10-2006, 02:17 PM
I'm not 100% sure of the main buyers of transport units, I'd imagine something like Hubbard and Gah, the body builders are the main bulk buyers with the transport repair firms after that?
Withe regard to Thermo king and Carrier, maybe the dealers being the biggest purchaser which then sell to body builders? I'm not sure, kinda guessing there..

cupidstunt79
03-11-2006, 01:41 AM
Zanotti transport refrigeration was just a name, the actuall company behind the operation was refrigeration ATP, i was unlucky enough to be working for them when someone run off with all the money cough cough sorry the company went into administration

djbe
03-11-2006, 08:17 PM
Zanotti transport refrigeration was just a name, the actuall company behind the operation was refrigeration ATP, i was unlucky enough to be working for them when someone run off with all the money cough cough sorry the company went into administration

:( :( You have my sympathies, I'm sure you and many of the other employees of refrigeration ATP didn't know they were working for one of the biggest d*#kheads in the business. Only his inner circle would have known what a crook he was, just look at his past record.;)

It's a shame really because I would guess that Zanotti is quite a reputable company. So this sorry little episode has only served to tarnish their reputation in the transport refrigeration trade.

As far as their fridges go I've only had the pleasure of attending a breakdown to one, a 495 I think. The compressor is nice bit of kit but the way everything else clunked, banged and leaked fluids reminded me of an old LOC!!!:eek:

And what is with the in cab controller?? Took me most of the job to figure out how to get the hours on the display.

Although there seem to be a few floating around I can't really see them seriously competing with Carrier, TK or for that matter Frigoblock in the UK.

Anyway, hope you've got yourself sorted with a new job:)

ZSPA
11-11-2006, 11:35 PM
:( :( You have my sympathies, I'm sure you and many of the other employees of refrigeration ATP didn't know they were working for one of the biggest d*#kheads in the business. Only his inner circle would have known what a crook he was, just look at his past record.;)

It's a shame really because I would guess that Zanotti is quite a reputable company. So this sorry little episode has only served to tarnish their reputation in the transport refrigeration trade.

As far as their fridges go I've only had the pleasure of attending a breakdown to one, a 495 I think. The compressor is nice bit of kit but the way everything else clunked, banged and leaked fluids reminded me of an old LOC!!!:eek:

And what is with the in cab controller?? Took me most of the job to figure out how to get the hours on the display.

Although there seem to be a few floating around I can't really see them seriously competing with Carrier, TK or for that matter Frigoblock in the UK.

Anyway, hope you've got yourself sorted with a new job:)

Also the factory in Italy didn't know. Sorry for them! I know anyway now they are re-organising a new company, Zanotti UK, and they are ready to move on again with some new serious people.
The units are good as the others as you can see many of them around everywhere in Europe and many other countries.
I guess the problem was that the crook was not able to organise the service for them properly as they have done from Italy in other countries.....in reefer business this is making a big difference.
I'm sure they will be back soon anyway..as I sure tehy have a big potential.....just saw some time ago on teh TK web site reserved area a page dedicated to a comparison between TK and Zanotti (not Carrier)...it means to me they worry about Zanotti as they can see a potential.

ZSPA
11-11-2006, 11:41 PM
if you need more info in english on Zanotti these are available also in Canada through their web site, I guess it's not difficult to check it out or give them a call there.
As far as the non Zanotti belts...well....maybe it's not too bad as it's easier and cheaper to find them on the market so we can make a bit more money and faster!!!!!!!!
If you need info on Zanotti contact me I have everything mate!

djbe
12-11-2006, 10:09 PM
Hi ZSPA,

Do you work for Zanotti?

regards,djbe

reefermadness
13-11-2006, 02:39 AM
The Zanotti reefer was sold through out the USA and Canada for 4 years without manuals or wiring schematics and information. There are still no parts manuals yet for some models. For instance, the Perkins in the dfz 465 is listed as one parts number. Try getting parts for the engine when they don't "exist". As well, if you are looking for English literature, then i would suggest England. In Canada the manuals are in French!! Then they are converted to English by people that can barely speak it, nevermind read and write. The grammer is so bad that its hard to even get the jist of it. All of Zanotti is based out of Montreal, Quebec, Canada.

In addition, i don't think that the nose mount will make one winter in here. None of the electrical connections are sealed......... thats right, butt connections. Very poor selection for placement of the alt, and many other components.

The biggest reason they are not going to sell in North America...... they cost more. Even if the dealers blow them out for cost, they are still more than TK and Carrier.

Anywho........i feel better know.

ReeferMadness

khosro nazem
11-08-2007, 09:07 PM
hi any one got any idea for mg monoblock monual instroction

smpsmp45
13-08-2007, 08:48 AM
Zanotti was operational in India for almost 15 years & we were the sole selling agents for them. The performance was quite impressive & we had done no of installations in Ice cream plants, Floriculture, Fish processing areas etc.

Recently Zanotti Family had some problems. There Key person left & started his own company, Technoblock & took over majority of Zanotti's business. Plus now they have a financial company now as an equity holder & it is true that they are facing some problems.
On the Truck units, the however, the experiece was not good at all. Thermokin/ Carrier are the best bets.

We had over 1500 Units of Zanotti all over India & even in Antartica ( with a heater on Condenser coil) We also had sepcial projects for Explosive atmosphere as well as for CA rooms.

REEFER-TEK
21-11-2007, 10:13 PM
Has anyone had anything to do with these reefers?? They are starting to show up in western canada now. I have hit the website and i'm impressed with the BTU ratings for these units. The body jobs are the only ones that i have seem in real life. Any information about them would be greatly apprieciated.

Reefermadness

I have seen them.,but not yet have had the opportunity to get up close and personal yet, I to was impressed with there BTU ratings, The guys at Jon Jo in missauga canada sell these units you may want to ask there group, tell them shawn from Reefer-Tek sent you. Also if you can get any info on these, I would be genuinly be grateful.

clivemtk
21-11-2007, 11:32 PM
do you have wiring diagrams for truck units in english willing to pay for postage maybe on c\d clive

REEFER-TEK
28-11-2007, 04:15 PM
do you have wiring diagrams for truck units in english willing to pay for postage maybe on c\d clive

Everything I have is for CTC,TK, complete transport product line Truck ,Trailer, Bus, APU, Marine container, and Gensets,

Mitsuibishi Marine container also parts and service.

I have nothing on zanotti.

I would like some info but am striking out there.

thermo prince
29-11-2007, 10:34 AM
With all respect to Zanotti, I would be inclined to agree with SMP45 from India- they made a good reputation in the static/commercial refrig field but perhaps have some ground to cover on the diesel powered transport equip.
Some trial trailer and diesel truck struggled in high ambient tests down in Australia as I heard it. Most European firms make the pitfall of sending ATP 30deg C approved stuff over to the tropics and learn the hard way. Dont know reputation on their o.e.d stuff ( off engine drive)but not seen much in Asia -Pac region.

Is it true that owner/management of Eliwell recently bought into Zanotti? or other way around?

thermo prince
05-12-2007, 08:29 AM
Just looking through the Nov edition of a US monthly mag called "Refrigerated Transporter" (www.refrigeratedtrans.com) - it may be worth overseas subscription for those of you in the cold chain links. USD 50 per annum for (sic)'Foreign surface mail'.

This month, it has the annual buyer's guide for insulated truck& trailer body manufacturers plus the refrigeration units themselves. Last month featured truck chassis and road tractors.

TK , Carrier feature as usual .... also this time " New World Zanotti" are in there.
TK & Carrier quote capacities , as they always did in the Americas, at ARI conditions , namely ....

100degF ambient ( +37.8C)
then box temps of 0 degF ( -18C) & -20degF (-29C)

NOTE : New World Zanotti quote numbers based on the European ATP ambient standard which is

Ambient +30degC ( 86degF)

and box temps of -4degF (-20C) and -20F
(-29C).

<<Normally ATP in Europe shows capacities at 30C amb for
0 degC / -10 degC / -20degC as I understand >>

Company name for those guys in US and Canada is :

New World Zanotto Transblock Inc,
2275 De la Province,
#200, Longueuil QC, Canada J4G 1GB.
sorry, they did not submit email or tel#.

regards
T-P

smpsmp45
06-12-2007, 09:11 AM
I know for sure that Zanotti ref in trucks is now a days making very good business & is giving a tough time to Thermoking as well as to Carrier. The design engg team is excellent by any standards & they had taken over other company for this truck ref. systems. After initial hiccups, they are now wback with good design features & they know what they sell & what they design.

I can get any ifnormation on them, their technical details etc. Pl send me PMS

thermo prince
06-12-2007, 12:49 PM
Hi SMPSMP45, :confused:

you sure changed your tune quite a bit since your August 13 posting !!! ;).
What changed your mind ....

Quote
"
Recently Zanotti Family had some problems. There Key person left & started his own company, Technoblock & took over majority of Zanotti's business. Plus now they have a financial company now as an equity holder & it is true that they are facing some problems.
On the Truck units, the however, the experiece was not good at all. Thermokin/ Carrier are the best bets. "

end quote

Did you have a dark visitor from Italy perhaps? Related to the Corleone family or ....:D :D

abbsnowman
28-01-2008, 08:36 AM
I know some contacts for them. They have been bugging me to be a dealer for years.
Stay tuned and I will check it out.

ryanzhao
28-01-2008, 10:55 AM
i would like to know what kinds of compressor in Zanotti units ?

best regards

absolute-zero
28-01-2008, 03:11 PM
I have heard of many engine problems, but recently there has been some improvements in this area.

I have somke hot sheets on these units in regards to TK testing in there R&D labs, and makes direct comparisons on 100 degrees simulations which are more commonly found here in differnt seasons of the year.

I am glad tk was able to do this in regards to find out true BTU ratings and comparisons to the ARI specifications of measurements and testings. I admit I was fooled by the BTU ratings in the beggining but soon as I saw an honest comparison, and soon learned of the marketing gimicks.

zanottis are not popular in my area, It hink people are looking for other options and more choices, but still the consumer here knows what both TK and CTC bring to the Market in value. I dont believe Zanotti will do well in my area, at least not while there are people like me here educating them.


Regards A-Z

NoNickName
28-01-2008, 04:03 PM
They use, among others, also our compressors (FRASCOLD).

abbsnowman
06-02-2008, 08:08 AM
The original DFZ430 had a sad little piston style compressor that was also used on Freightliner A/C. Sold a few of those!

sam4000
13-02-2008, 06:03 PM
Has anyone had anything to do with these reefers?? They are starting to show up in western canada now. I have hit the website and i'm impressed with the BTU ratings for these units. The body jobs are the only ones that i have seem in real life. Any information about them would be greatly apprieciated.

Reefermadness

The ac electric motors in stand-by units are 50 cycle not 60 as canada

absolute-zero
14-02-2008, 10:23 PM
The ac electric motors in stand-by units are 50 cycle not 60 as canada

Huh, where did that come from?
I think I have been confused.....:confused:

Heres a summary of what I know about electric motors.

Basically, motors are designed to meet nameplate performance. Although 3-phase AC motors will operate at a wide range of speeds, their performance will change as a function of the applied frequency. Maintaining the proper volts per hertz will allow a given motor to operate over an extended speed range with constant torque.

Running a 60Hz motor at 50 Hz alone does not cause the motor to overheat, but without a proportional decrease in voltage, the motor will overheat. By increasing the volts/hertz by running the motor at 460V, the 50Hz motor will saturate, causing overheating.

By reducing the voltage to 380 volts, the motor will produce rated torque at a lower base speed. Overheating of a motor is always application dependent. Motor lifetime is more dependent on the operating temperature of the motor, so application and proper volts/hertz will affect the lifetime of the motor.

Be cautious with the load applied, if the motor is coupled to a device like a fan, and the same original assembly is connected to 60 Hz, the mechanical power demand will increase with the cubic power of the fan speed increase.


A-Z

swissreefer
20-02-2008, 11:37 PM
Zanotti is just a italian supplier (sory guys). Sale the unit and ask me in 8 years again for replacement. No aftersales. No Parts. No support. Bank Holliday the whole summer. The chief engeneer was from Carrier Europe. So it's near by the same. Compressors are from BOCK. I've arranged the mounting for the airportunits. Now we got problems with the compressor mounting kit from autoclimate. The decision to take Zanotti for this deal was not based on the unit. There are familar connections between Zanotti an the financier on the airportdeal.

daniel ox
20-03-2008, 06:10 AM
In australia ZANOTTI have had many issues with back up after sales service, as warranty was not getting paid to the companies doing warranty work on them, also here we have many electrical problems with them, mainly the 465 and 495, the alternators seem to go through brush sets like it is fuel, also in my experience there cheap here so companies that buy them really cant afford the heavy repair bills that these units can manage to generate, just be careful of the people that buy them. Transfrig is trying to move into the oz market, have you had any thing to do with them, any good or stay away?

SKOOBY
20-03-2008, 10:03 PM
ZANNOTTI Steer well clear a few Blue Chip companies
in the UK have been well burned.
Engines, compressors and about every other item
you could think of fails
Totally unreliable transport unit

djbe
21-03-2008, 12:00 AM
[QUOTE=SKOOBY;98070]
Engines, compressors and about every other item
you could think of fails
[/QUOTE

Yes they do, but that could be said of all manufacturers. I would disagree on the compressors because for the most part they are Bock and usually very good.

The difference is the back up is not good, spares availability is poor and more importantly technical support. The wiring diagrams and manuals do not give enough info. to allow a decent engineer to trace a problem.

I know that if i go to a TK or Carrier with a wiring problem that I can trace it micro or no micro. And more importantly possibly get the unit going if I don't have the parts.

If I go to a Zanotti with a wiring problem I know that I can trace it....... back to the circuit boards then no further info. If you try to get back up nobody seems to know.

Maybe they will learn and change but remember they are from italy, remind me of the fridge version of an Alfa Romeo cool like F**K but the electrics are S**T.:D:D

geoffthefridgem
31-03-2008, 06:50 AM
Hi Guys ,Just to let you know that ZANOTTI now own Hubbard Transport Refrigeration and have renamed the company Hubbard Products and all units built buy Hubbard are badged HUBBARD by Zanotti.So zanotti are here to stay. Hubbard are still based in Ipswich but nowkeep a stock of zanotti spares on the shelf.

SKOOBY
31-03-2008, 09:33 PM
I hope they have a large stock of parts as they will
need them.
Also the parts are very expensive.As i said before totally unreliable.
They may have Bock compressors but with all the other problems these fail also

absolute-zero
01-04-2008, 01:14 AM
I have never seen a service manual or wiring scheme on zanotti unit.. I have been to the website but nothing really publicated for the engineer.

SKOOBY
01-04-2008, 10:57 PM
They are available but you have to have password etc simalar toTK dealer Web site,
You would probably be better off with a box of matches and weigh in for scrap than repair one

abbsnowman
02-04-2008, 05:52 AM
I have never seen a service manual or wiring scheme on zanotti unit.. I have been to the website but nothing really publicated for the engineer.
I have a disk that says Zanotti on it. I will see if I can wash the beer can ring off it and see whats in there. I just assumed it was to make pretty rainbow colors on my wall from the sun.
:confused:

absolute-zero
02-04-2008, 02:55 PM
I have a disk that says Zanotti on it. I will see if I can wash the beer can ring off it and see whats in there. I just assumed it was to make pretty rainbow colors on my wall from the sun.
:confused:

I dont see any Zanottis in my area, so the need for parts or service publications, is not really needed at this time. I just would have liked to read up on them in case one ever showed up in my back yard with problems.

SKOOBY
02-04-2008, 10:15 PM
Just hope they don,t turn up in your back yard.
You may need medication

abbsnowman
03-04-2008, 04:32 AM
Just hope they don,t turn up in your back yard.
You may need medication
I think there is a cream for that!:eek:

absolute-zero
03-04-2008, 06:07 AM
Just hope they don,t turn up in your back yard.
You may need medication

My area is full of Thermo King, In a Carrier town Syracuse NY. We have both product lines here but TK seems to be taking the market share very strong.

Skooby do you service many Zanottis? I was talking to rep from Zanotti the other day, the gentlemen I talked to sure would like to move there product line in my area.

abbsnowman
03-04-2008, 06:58 AM
My area is full of Thermo King, In a Carrier town Syracuse NY. We have both product lines here but TK seems to be taking the market share very strong.

Skooby do you service many Zanottis? I was talking to rep from Zanotti the other day, the gentlemen I talked to sure would like to move there product line in my area.
Was his name Zolli? If so tell him I said hi!

absolute-zero
03-04-2008, 07:32 AM
Was his name Zolli? If so tell him I said hi!

His name was Julio Gonzalez

SKOOBY
03-04-2008, 10:50 PM
Yes we maintain a large amount.When they came into the UK.They were marketed through a franchise
person.I think he was related to the late AL CAPONE.
They should have set up a proper dealer network with professionals and they would have had a buffer.
Instead a lot of operators are stuck with units that are allways failing.They purchased Hubbard and market them under the Hubard name now to try and get some credability.Frigoblock are very strong now
0n distribution trucks.I am a TK man at heart Carrier Vector has had the market but the SLX will change that

myreefer
04-04-2008, 11:50 PM
Hey guys,
I've seen Zanotti units at truck show and also spoke to gentlement at show and know little bit about them. Well, through their products and base on my experience with reefers, Zanotti sale in North America is not quite as much as TK or CT, reason being is their price is too high which compare to CT and just little bit lower than TK base on same BTU with compare to their competitors. Their control panel kinda confuse users a lot (atleast with me) not friendly like CT or TK. The image of unit is kinda look like TK but the guts is CT. But there is one thing good is unit run quitely and less vibration than TK & CT and specially in standby mode. Yes, they use Perkin engine and Bock compressor on their products. Like other said: wiring is unseal and even the logic board ( this suck and cheapy). The bracketry system more firmer than their compatitors & that's greater than CT nor TK. ONE THING WHAT I THINK IS IMPORTANT FOR THEM IS LOWER THEIR PRICE WHEN FIRST START IN N.A SO ATLEAST COMSUMER WILLING TO TRY OUT. There is slow sale so their support is kinda slow also which I heard. Any unit which doesn't matter it make by CT or TK still have a problem either electrical nor mechanical and if you are a reefer tech you should know that as well as Zanotti so face the true those. TK is alsway have problem with electrical, CT is mechanical problem. So what the deal, face it as you choose. At result, no one perfect..... ZANOTTI.... PRICE & TECHNICAL SUPPORT.... that only thing I, personally concern.

abbsnowman
05-04-2008, 05:35 AM
MYREEFER, I think they gave up! Too bad they didn't offer more support. I could have helped them go far but like others are not willing to take all the burden!

SKOOBY
10-04-2008, 11:14 PM
Just priced a compressor for 495 overcab £4000 uk
Pounds now that is pricey

abbsnowman
11-04-2008, 12:01 AM
yikes!:eek:

paulo almeida
11-04-2008, 12:39 AM
i,m from Portugal and i d'onh have any information of Zanotti, can you send-me some manual and tecnical information?

abbsnowman
11-04-2008, 08:05 AM
i,m from Portugal and i d'onh have any information of Zanotti, can you send-me some manual and tecnical information?
Paulo, go back through this thread and you will see that info is difficult to get on these machines and it seems they may no longer produce equiptment?

paulo almeida
12-04-2008, 01:08 PM
Hi ZSPA

Can youi send-me information of Zanotti?

Best regards

abbsnowman
12-04-2008, 05:25 PM
If anyone has anything, I would like it to. Nothing like working on a machine without a wiring schematic!
They were burning out glow plugs. We had to re-wire them so they would not leave glow plugs on or put them on when unit was running.
You can figure them out, just takes some time. We only have 2 left in our area.:p

marsVesselin
24-04-2008, 09:40 AM
Hi ZSPA

Can youi send-me information of Zanotti?

Best regards

SKOOBY
24-04-2008, 10:36 PM
You sound like a salesman for Zanotti.

nova
02-06-2008, 08:44 AM
HI Guys,

I read this thread with great interest and I was kind of shocked to see how bad ppl opinion is. Is it really that bad brand? I have no experience of Zanotti units, but I know direct drive units has been sold in Finland for years and haven't heard that much of any problems. Also I've seen some new truck units and at least the assemblage (?) is with the same level as with CTC & TK.

There are many particular problems addressed here, but as I work in a TK dealer and used to work in Carrier dealer I've seen and heard many problems with the units. Also even though TK & Carrier wiring diagrams are ok, you can basicly just see the sensor - micro - solenoid-ring. Rest is taken care with the software & operation logic, which is more or less unknown / uninformed area to the dealers. Sure something is given out, but not enough.

So I'm just curious if things are put in the right perspective, is Zanotti truck & trailer units that bad? I mean the brand new units, not 5 years old or so.

Ok, lack of technical support, that's a huge problem. TK has an excellent support in ESA and I supposed in NAD too.

If any of you have seen / worked with the new Zanotti units (manufactured in this or last year) I'd like to hear more experiences.

Thanks

-nova

SKOOBY
02-06-2008, 10:54 PM
Beleive me they are the pits

pinoytoits
03-06-2008, 12:21 AM
go to afr refrigeration based in london sure they can give you a hand on these manuals.

SKOOBY
03-06-2008, 10:46 PM
:mad:AFR are commercial refrigeration not
Transport.
Hubbard are now Zannotti

abbsnowman
05-06-2008, 07:10 PM
They have sold equiptment here with no support.

ZSPA
06-06-2008, 03:51 PM
Hi ZSPA

Can youi send-me information of Zanotti?

Best regards
sorry for not answering before but was away for long. I guess the best way to get these info is to contact them hrough the web site as I have had a look and there all contact details of their people plus all contact details of their dealer in the different countries.
If you find that difficult let me know in detail what you need and I will check if I have it.
Thanks

ZSPA
06-06-2008, 03:52 PM
They have sold equiptment here with no support.
have you tried to speak with their people there. Once I had some problem and called the factory and they have been very co-operative

ZSPA
06-06-2008, 04:08 PM
HI Guys,

I read this thread with great interest and I was kind of shocked to see how bad ppl opinion is. Is it really that bad brand? I have no experience of Zanotti units, but I know direct drive units has been sold in Finland for years and haven't heard that much of any problems. Also I've seen some new truck units and at least the assemblage (?) is with the same level as with CTC & TK.

There are many particular problems addressed here, but as I work in a TK dealer and used to work in Carrier dealer I've seen and heard many problems with the units. Also even though TK & Carrier wiring diagrams are ok, you can basicly just see the sensor - micro - solenoid-ring. Rest is taken care with the software & operation logic, which is more or less unknown / uninformed area to the dealers. Sure something is given out, but not enough.

So I'm just curious if things are put in the right perspective, is Zanotti truck & trailer units that bad? I mean the brand new units, not 5 years old or so.

Ok, lack of technical support, that's a huge problem. TK has an excellent support in ESA and I supposed in NAD too.

If any of you have seen / worked with the new Zanotti units (manufactured in this or last year) I'd like to hear more experiences.

Thanks

-nova

Nova, you got the point! machines are machines and I have noticed working with TK and Carrier and Zanotti units that many of the components are exactly the same model, brand/supplier (see manuli hoses for Zanotti and Carrier, SPAL fans from Italy for all 3 of them, ECO coils, Danfoss, and many other parts), this means obviously that machines are very similar in teh way they are working (that's transport refrigeration engineering at the end of the day and it is a science as far me concern).

Why somebody say that Zanotti units are bad and then somebody say TK are no more King and then the same about Carrier???????

In my poor opinion the difference is made by the local dealer in each country and in the service network the dealer is setting up! No blaim on the main factories but in the way the dealers are organising the markets.

As for my experience all brands are bad in some country and very good in some others......why??????

A machine is a machine, what is making teh difference is always people behind that!

SKOOBY
06-06-2008, 10:29 PM
I think you are Mr Zannotti.
The only way they can sell anything
now in the uk is under the Hubbard
name for camaflage.

nova
08-06-2008, 08:13 AM
But is it because of the unit or the local importer / service network or lack of it? As ZSPA wrote perhaps it's the ppl behind the product, not the product itself?

I've read about the electrical problems in Canada, but I also read that all Zanotti units were delivered 70% ready to Canada and the electrics were put in afterwards in Canada.

I'm not saying Zanotti is superb, just trying to put things in more neutral perspective.


-nova

abbsnowman
05-07-2008, 07:58 AM
have you tried to speak with their people there. Once I had some problem and called the factory and they have been very co-operative

When one sells units, one expects manuals in ones language in order to support.

abbsnowman
05-07-2008, 08:08 AM
But is it because of the unit or the local importer / service network or lack of it? As ZSPA wrote perhaps it's the ppl behind the product, not the product itself?

I've read about the electrical problems in Canada, but I also read that all Zanotti units were delivered 70% ready to Canada and the electrics were put in afterwards in Canada.

I'm not saying Zanotti is superb, just trying to put things in more neutral perspective.


-nova

Nova, you love to preach but often don't broaden your knowlage.
The problem with Zanotti were I am is this, (oh and trust me I know), they came here ready to take on TK and Carrier but had done no reserch on language, market or personel at all. I would never say they have a poor product but how do I read an Italian wiring diagram when I speak English?
I have been through these machines and self taught enough to keep 2 of the 3 in my area running.
They are all but gone from what I see here in Canada and I would welcome them back if they brought some good support and the right people selling them.
As for your comments Nova, again what do you know? Whats your back ground?

ali_engineer
06-07-2008, 08:06 PM
Has anyone had anything to do with these reefers?? They are starting to show up in western canada now. I have hit the website and i'm impressed with the BTU ratings for these units. The body jobs are the only ones that i have seem in real life. Any information about them would be greatly apprieciated.

Reefermadness
Hi mate:
I am a refrigeration service engineer living in England. Is it possible to speak to you via your email? if so, please send an instante email to mine one which is hvca_engineers@yahoo.co.uk

Many thanks

Ali
Birmingham, UK

Cold Consultant
18-07-2008, 09:12 AM
Gossip and speculation is a very dangerous thing. Has anyone thought of speaking with Zanotti in Italy? A more open bunch of people you couldn't hope to meet.
For legal reasons they cannot comment on the last management head in the UK. Last seen riding off on his horse with a handkerchief covering his face!
I used to operate around 150 direct drive units and found that if you spoke to someone in parts high enough up the chain, things happened as required. The units themselves were no more, or indeed less, trouble than others available. The engineers working on them were the reason I bought them. A diligent bunch who cared about their customers. They were seriously let down by the then management.
The new team heading up Hubbard Zanotti (note the priority going to Hubbard) are very professional and have moved the company well into the 21st century with improved parts supply, maintenance agreements and support structure. Definitely one to watch closely. I think you'll see others following their lead. They have this new idea of actually LISTENING to their customers and will adapt equipment to suit their needs! Revolutionary!
I'll get off my soap box now. But before I go.....They had one bad apple but it doesn't spoil the whole barrel!

SKOOBY
22-07-2008, 09:12 PM
I dont suppose the Direct drives are to bad lets face it theres not a lot to go wrong.But the diesls were and posibly stil are totally unreliable you need a big FAT wallet to keep them functioning.:mad:

UKGENT
27-07-2008, 10:19 AM
I dont suppose the Direct drives are to bad lets face it theres not a lot to go wrong.But the diesls were and posibly stil are totally unreliable you need a big FAT wallet to keep them functioning.:mad:

I agree Hubbard aka Zannoti and GAH should stick to there market area which is direct drive. They should leave the engine units to the diesel monkeys TK and Carrier.
;)

clivemtk
27-07-2008, 08:49 PM
have you info on zanotti on a dvd

SKOOBY
28-07-2008, 09:45 PM
:p:oYes its called MISSION IMPOSSIBLE

abbsnowman
30-07-2008, 12:12 AM
:p:oYes its called MISSION IMPOSSIBLE

LOL thats funny! Hey Skooby how ya doing?:D

carch
31-07-2008, 04:11 PM
New to this forum, not a big fan of Zanotti. It is correct that the origional ones brought in to Canada and the US were only partially built before being sent here. The electrical components were added in after as the origional ones were not approved by our govenments. I do however have a bunch of Zanotti manuals on CD all in english. if any one is looking for info please contact me.

clivemtk
31-07-2008, 08:18 PM
carch please send your e\mail address private

myreefer
04-11-2008, 05:11 PM
One service center that I know whom dealer for Northwest Zanotti Transblock just let me know distributor in Canada (NORTHWEST ZANOTTI TRANSBLOCK) has been collapsed. New one which created in North part of US (either in Washington or Chicago area) and run by the same Sale Prep (I think his name is Joli). Reason they collapsed is....they made no profit so they not provided much support, markup so high on parts, units, time delay on orders, cheated or not honor on warranty (a lot of unpaid warranty invoices which submitted by dealerships). They're so cheapy, liar and never support or listened to what market wanted or needed. Hope new distributor do it better job (specially the guy name Joli). They f_ _ k every their dealers up before they closed down. Can not trust the damm Canadian (Joli) so careful when he approached. Sorry, I was feel bad for any who dealer for Nothwest Zanotti Transblock or has been dealing with them.

jerseyboy
05-11-2008, 02:42 AM
The guys name is Zoli, and I share your sentiments.

abbsnowman
08-11-2008, 05:43 AM
I know Zollie! I think he is still involved. I should check it out. On a personal (Non Buisness), level, he is realy not a bad guy.

EasternTempCon
08-09-2009, 05:16 PM
Zanotti will ultimately fail in the US Market. Those who purchased Zanotti refrigeration will not be able to get parts and be left with a worthless unit. History has shown the market is only large enough to support TK & Carrier and a 3rd tier player can not survive.

abbsnowman
09-09-2009, 04:56 AM
the market is only large enough to support TK & Carrier and a 3rd tier player can not survive.[/quote]


I totaly disagree. That sounds like Ford and Chevy in the early 80'S.
I think there soon will be a third and possibly fourth player. They just need to market it properly.
One question though.... Temp con was bought by Carrier years ago. Whats with the name?

EasternTempCon
10-09-2009, 12:49 PM
You may be right. However, Zanotti's product & support feels like those Yugo cars that unfortunate buyers got stuck with.

abbsnowman
11-09-2009, 05:34 AM
Ya, so whats up with the temp con?? lol

absolute-zero
04-10-2009, 08:19 PM
the market is only large enough to support TK & Carrier and a 3rd tier player can not survive.


I totaly disagree. That sounds like Ford and Chevy in the early 80'S.
I think there soon will be a third and possibly fourth player. They just need to market it properly.
One question though.... Temp con was bought by Carrier years ago. Whats with the name?[/quote]

Abbs,
My original thoughts were zannotti would have been a strong contender in the TRU US market place. However, I now do not think they will due to well considering the screwing they gave to allot of customers in my region in which caused them to trade out fairly new zannotti equipment for TK or CTC units.

It is what it is.

A-Z

abbsnowman
06-10-2009, 06:15 AM
I think eventualy someone will come up with the cash and the platform and then more will follow.

absolute-zero
06-10-2009, 02:40 PM
I think eventualy someone will come up with the cash and the platform and then more will follow.

Well if it does it will be a long road of reconstruction on the eastern coast of the US. Customers remember things like this.

abbsnowman
06-10-2009, 04:28 PM
The way this site shows "posted by..." when I quote makes it look like the original comment was mine.
I doubt Zanotti has a snowballs chance in hell but someone with a reliable name.... say Toyota, as only an example, may be welcome with open arms.

EasternTempCon
08-10-2009, 02:05 AM
What is going on in the Florida van & small truck market? Are their many Vehicle Power units? What body companies and reefer providers doing well? In the Northeast, Subzero Technologies in Brooklyn provides the best quality product. TK & Carrier are the primary reefer providers. Zanotti has a reputationi for over-promising and under-delivering.

absolute-zero
08-10-2009, 03:09 AM
What is going on in the Florida van & small truck market? Are their many Vehicle Power units? What body companies and reefer providers doing well? In the Northeast, Subzero Technologies in Brooklyn provides the best quality product. TK & Carrier are the primary reefer providers. Zanotti has a reputationi for over-promising and under-delivering.

Vehicle powerd unit market in florida would be Miami. Although they are also in other places but the abundance of them are in south Florida. If I remeber correctly wasnt subzero a distributor or dealer for zannoti up in boston or new jersey area?

A-Z

thermo prince
08-10-2009, 04:28 AM
.
I doubt Zanotti has a snowballs chance in hell but someone with a reliable name.... say Toyota, as only an example, may be welcome with open arms.

Abbs,
I doubt if Toyota would be interested; they are much too wise and besides, Toyota-Hino Motors group already have keiretsu strategic partnership with Denso.

I have an idea ..... why don't you take it on as project!
I can foresee the headlines now ......

<< Canada xx/yy/2009. In a daring Corporate raid that has taken Wall St by surprise, it was announced today that Abominable Snowman Co. of Brit. Columbia has acquired majority shareholding of "Zorro" brand refrig units from Europe. A press release shortly is expected to advise that after a period of restructuring, the product will be re-badged and sold under brand name "Abominable Transport Refrigerator" >> end headline.:D

As you suggested "I doubt Z has a snowballs chance in hell ' but you know, they say heaven loves a trier!
Go on man ... give it a try.

regards,
T-P.

abbsnowman
08-10-2009, 05:04 AM
How do you see the world when your head is clearly up your ......

Boss302
08-10-2009, 06:13 AM
I am in the US, midwest, I have never seen a Zanotti, but from what I have read here, I would never tell anybody to buy one. Sounds like a real POS.

EasternTempCon
08-10-2009, 10:34 AM
Vehicle powerd unit market in florida would be Miami. Although they are also in other places but the abundance of them are in south Florida. If I remeber correctly wasnt subzero a distributor or dealer for zannoti up in boston or new jersey area?

A-Z

Subzero is a van & body insulation company based in New York City area. Like any body company, they will provide solutions for any refrigeration manufacturer.

A company called GSD based in Boston area distributes Zanotti units to customers and sub-dealers along the Eastern US (including Miami). GSD does this under another company they own called Zanotti East.

absolute-zero
08-10-2009, 12:52 PM
Subzero is a van & body insulation company based in New York City area. Like any body company, they will provide solutions for any refrigeration manufacturer.

A company called GSD based in Boston area distributes Zanotti units to customers and sub-dealers along the Eastern US (including Miami). GSD does this under another company they own called Zanotti East.

Thanks for the clarification, I believe we used Subzero for insulating some vans when I was with the TK dealer in Albany NY. Subzero also sells insulation kits for vans as well, if this is correct I think several dealers down here buy them for insulating spinters.

absolute-zero
08-10-2009, 12:54 PM
I think the we may see Abbs and T-P, on the next seasons of ultimate fighter. :D

A-Z

absolute-zero
08-10-2009, 05:34 PM
I am in the US, midwest, I have never seen a Zanotti, but from what I have read here, I would never tell anybody to buy one. Sounds like a real POS.

I have not heard of the unit being a POS, but have heard from many customers that the product support through service and parts from a historical and current day perspecitve is the biggest issue.

Once they break down the customer is out from equipment utilization. This leads to unecessary downtime which relates to profitability issues as well causes them to lose money and customers.

They did have a good go at it here in the US right out of the gate, however they simply lacked the long haul stamina in supporting the product.

A-Z

thermo prince
08-10-2009, 06:41 PM
To the mods Brian, Frank, Chilln et al - if possible and unless the use of bad language deteriorates over next couple of days that its not justifiable , try leave this thread open.

I wish to make some reasoned comments by way of reply to earlier venom posted above.

thanks guys.
T-P

abbsnowman
09-10-2009, 03:51 PM
Instead, why don't you save the good members of this site the drama and give me a call!
Oh and notice, after you read my reply, I edited it for above reason.
Take it outside or get over it.

vincent74605
21-12-2010, 12:46 PM
its already two years now, but is it possible to contact you for getting zanotti uniblock information/funcational

cadwaladr
21-12-2010, 04:37 PM
i have contacted zanotti on info and have had very good responce,think the guys name was rudy google them for links again this was for uniblock info not transport!

Oregonbythesea
21-12-2010, 09:00 PM
Abbsnowman, you are quite right about a third unit coming soon. I don't know about the fourth. I do know that the third will be different than anything else on the market and the service aspect of the units will attract anyone. It is a really hard uphill battle in this economy to get a new product to the market.

abbsnowman
22-12-2010, 06:42 AM
Ohhh do tell Oregon!
I can see this market busting open some time soon. Don't know if it will be good for everyone or bad but you can't hold all the market share for ever.
On the topic of Zanotti, I have had a few conversations lately with people that are in fact very happy with the work that has been done by them and the commitment they have to penatrating this market. I suppose time will tell but maybe we are close to them grabbing some serious attention.
Rome was not built in a day but has had many rulers!
Cheers everyone. Happy holidays.
Miss ya Thermo! Hope all is well for you!
Abbs

Oregonbythesea
23-12-2010, 07:24 PM
Merry Christmas to all those that celebrate it and Happy New Year to all the others. And, may it be a safe a prosperous year for all.

ZoO
29-12-2010, 06:18 AM
Zanotti is having a week long factory sponsored dealer training course in Orlando Fl in mid January. there they plan to unveil the new equiptment.

thermo prince
12-01-2011, 02:29 AM
Hi Abbs and all the members,

Wishing everybody a happy healthy and prosperous year in 2011 and beyond.

All's well in AP - been a bit occupied with office and home relocation this past while.

Where did 2010 go to .... the Romans did say 'tempis fugit' but it's alarming how the time is flying by.

As always, keep it cool!
all the best
T-P

ZoO
30-01-2011, 11:46 PM
Zanotti is now manufacturing it's new Uno truck unit (diesel engine) with the yanmar engine.

It is also introducing a completely redesigned direct drive unit (The Zero series) It utilizes a completely new condenser technology, that allows for greater capacity in a smaller package.

And it has introduced the EFZ the all electric truck unit. This unit utilizes the Aura generator and CPU to run an extremely quite refrigeration unit.

Oregonbythesea
31-01-2011, 12:58 AM
Caution is called for when looking at the Aura generator. For the Kw needed, it will not be small. I have been watching this company for about 4 years now and have my questions about it. They also tried to make an electric unit at a small company in the SE US. It wasn't very impressive. Their claims for the generator seem to be pretty stretched. Let the buyer beware, A full size unit still requires 20 hp or so to operate. If you factor in the reserve hp for longevity, it is closer to 25 hp that must be available. A belt driven generator/alternator on the engine of that size is going to be cumbersome to say the least.

ZoO
31-01-2011, 01:25 AM
The over all power consumption for the EFZ is about 5 KW they have paired that with a 8 KW generator. Zanotti has specially built the EFZ to work with the Aura gen, as an over the road all electric system.

In the past Aura has tried to pair it's gen system with standard refrigeration equipment, and place it in a transport role, based solely on it's power consumption. This was an admitted mistake because of unforeseen variables in a refrigeration system that is being utilized in a transport role.

That is why the engineers with Zanotti have been exclusively working with Aura in the last couple of years to develop a system that will work in this specific application.

The gen is mounted to a PTO or in line with the truck belt system. The truck we looked at (PTO) was neat clean and everything was accessible. At the facility we were at, we tested the gen system's parasitic draw, and at full field, it drew a total of 15 hp. The system averaged about 8 to 10 while in cool about 6hp in heat. So in reality the Aura/Zanotti system pulls less on the engine than the driver's a/c compressor.

When we switched the truck was off, The unit itself was as loud as the average home A/C system. The gen did make an audible wine, but at speed/rpm the truck's turbo drown out any system noise what so ever.

I honestly think we are about to come into a new age of transport refrigeration.

Oregonbythesea
31-01-2011, 02:01 AM
My mistake. I thought we were talking about a full size trailer unit. The unit you describe is one of the smaller units used on straight trucks. I have a feeling that field is pretty will covered with existing equipment. BTW, Peterbuilt has been working with using the electric hybrid equipment on their trucks to power reefer units. I think they have just about got it perfected. I am surprised this post has been permitted because it sounds like spam to me. Sorry if I am wrong but, it sounds like you have more than just a passing fancy with Zanotti.

ZoO
31-01-2011, 03:27 AM
My mistake. I thought we were talking about a full size trailer unit. The unit you describe is one of the smaller units used on straight trucks. I have a feeling that field is pretty will covered with existing equipment. BTW, Peterbuilt has been working with using the electric hybrid equipment on their trucks to power reefer units. I think they have just about got it perfected. I am surprised this post has been permitted because it sounds like spam to me. Sorry if I am wrong but, it sounds like you have more than just a passing fancy with Zanotti.

"This post" is just to point out what i believe to be a new direction in the transport refrigeration industry. This is not a case of spam because I am not selling anything, I am not redirecting members to another site, nor am I promoting one brand over another. This thread was not even started by me. I was started originally inquiring about Zanotti, and i am simply sharing new news on that product, for anyone who cares to know about new Zanotti news/products.

As far as peterbuilt's efforts are concerned, this would also point to the direction of the all electric unit.. Does the mere mentioning of this technology by Peterbuilt make your efforts spam?

So Why should mine be judged that way? Is it because i speak from first hand knowledge, and not from rumor or magazine articles? when someone asks a thermo king or carrier specific question is the person providing a first hand knowledge or a first hand account answer to that question considered a spamer?

That said, (Since you brought it up) Zanotti does have a full sized trailer unit in field trials right now. and BTW the technology that i had mentioned earlier is no longer being tested it is in full production and available to the market.

You are correct in that the EFZ is a truck unit. one with a BTU range somewhere between a supra 850, and a TS500.

One question for you, do you have any examples current production models of "Existing Equipment" that fit the all electric role?

NoNickName
31-01-2011, 08:37 AM
Zanotti is having a week long factory sponsored dealer training course in Orlando Fl in mid January. there they plan to unveil the new equiptment.

Not new. They just bought out Transblock, which is now Zanotti Transblock. They are reaching a peculiar size, that the European Union Antitrust commission may be interested in.

Oregonbythesea
31-01-2011, 04:31 PM
ZoO, as I said before, sorry if you are not connected to Zanotti. It just looks that way. As for the all electric units. They aren't new as mentioned already. As to their use in transport refrigeration, I don't think it is the most efficient way to go. That is my opinion based on losses in the power train from start to finish. I think there will be some better units coming out soon with different types of technology that will be better suited to the savings in fuel. I also think the use of AC voltage in transport units has a built in problem for owners and mechanics that make it unsafe in some conditions. Transicold has reinvented their version of an old Thermo King electric unit if your looking for electric trailer units. The wiring in those units were a nightmare. I can't see how the new units can be much better. Good luck with the Zanotti. It is probably just as good as any of the rest.

Oregonbythesea
31-01-2011, 04:32 PM
Oops, hit the button twice.

charlie patt
31-01-2011, 07:54 PM
have read all with interest the moral of our story in the uk is keep it for 3 years then ditch it quick, or have deep pockets very deep pockets parts i believe they think of a number and trebble it back up nill nothing at all the units in my opinion are trouble and before someone jumps on me back and tells me there ok like everyone you get good and bad but fron our side which is a engineers side they are bad news

ZoO
31-01-2011, 09:33 PM
Not new. They just bought out Transblock, which is now Zanotti Transblock. They are reaching a peculiar size, that the European Union Antitrust commission may be interested in.

Actually no, Transblock is simply the name assigned to the transport refrigeration division of Zanotti.. Kinda like Carrier Transicold. Zanotti's units
(The transblocks) were known as the FZ and the DFZ models. The FZ being the standard direct drive, and the DFZ being the diesel. The NEW Zero replaces the FZ series which include a complete redesign of the condensing section, separating the refrigeration components, from the completely redesigned condenser coil, to the electrical components, making servicing as simple as removing two bolts in most cases, and sliding off the side panel..

And the NEW Uno replaces the DFZ's above the 435, that included the Perkins engine, with a direct drive Yanmar engine coupled straight to a bock compressor. (The unit only has one belt) Not to mention completely new skins, that were inspired by Italian super cars.

Plus Zanotti has unleashed the EFZ which is a completely new concept that no one else seems to be developing..

So again Zanotti has completely redesigned it's entire line of (Transblock) equipment.

Oregonbythesea
31-01-2011, 09:45 PM
I rest my case.

ZoO
31-01-2011, 09:54 PM
ZoO, as I said before, sorry if you are not connected to Zanotti.
ZoO stands for: Zanotti of Orlando I never said I was not connected to Zanotti in anyway. I only said i am not here to sell anything, just to give facts about the changes being made in this industry. specifically with this product.


As for the all electric units. They aren't new as mentioned already.That is why I ask for specific models. I have not heard of any nor can I find any when I do a search.


As to their use in transport refrigeration, I don't think it is the most efficient way to go. That is my opinion based on losses in the power train from start to finish.
As I said in a full Field situation where maximum draw is being placed on the truck, there is only a 12 hp draw. In normal operation the parasitic draw averages around 6 to 8hp (Depending on box temp and amb temp, and truck.) Overall That is less than the drivers A/C compressor. when the unit cycles off there is not any draw.


I think there will be some better units coming out soon with different types of technology that will be better suited to the savings in fuel.Zanotti has skipped fuel savings in favor of no fuel being used to directly power the unit. Not to mention there is nothing to maintain on the unit.


I also think the use of AC voltage in transport units has a built in problem for owners and mechanics that make it unsafe in some conditions. How do these conditions differ from standard cold plate technology? Those systems have been married to trucks for decades.


Transicold has reinvented their version of an old Thermo King electric unit if your looking for electric trailer units.
What is the "new" carrier called? How is it powered? Is it using A/C voltage? Why do you consider this safe and what Zanotti has done unsafe?



The wiring in those units were a nightmare. I can't see how the new units can be much better. Good luck with the Zanotti. It is probably just as good as any of the rest.

time will tell.

ZoO
31-01-2011, 09:56 PM
I rest my case.
??? What case?

charlie patt
31-01-2011, 10:29 PM
Actually no, Transblock is simply the name assigned to the transport refrigeration division of Zanotti.. Kinda like Carrier Transicold. Zanotti's units
(The transblocks) were known as the FZ and the DFZ models. The FZ being the standard direct drive, and the DFZ being the diesel. The NEW Zero replaces the FZ series which include a complete redesign of the condensing section, separating the refrigeration components, from the completely redesigned condenser coil, to the electrical components, making servicing as simple as removing two bolts in most cases, and sliding off the side panel..

And the NEW Uno replaces the DFZ's above the 435, that included the Perkins engine, with a direct drive Yanmar engine coupled straight to a bock compressor. (The unit only has one belt) Not to mention completely new skins, that were inspired by Italian super cars.

Plus Zanotti has unleashed the EFZ which is a completely new concept that no one else seems to be developing..

So again Zanotti has completely redesigned it's entire line of (Transblock) equipment.
reliability/fuel saveings includeing ac/dc generators that put a load on a engine anyway and weight and cost/ this is what a operator wants and these are the people that purchase the products o yes and a decent back up service that includes a reasonable price and time to get parts this is zanotties downfall parts are murder and next week will do? its to the point in our neck of the woods no zanotties go on critical loads.

ZoO
31-01-2011, 11:12 PM
[QUOTE]reliability/fuel savings including ac/dc generators that put a load on a engine anyway
As I said in a full Field situation where maximum draw is being placed on the truck, there is only a 12 hp draw. In normal operation the parasitic draw averages around 6 to 8hp (Depending on box temp and amb temp, and truck.) Overall That is less than the drivers A/C compressor. when the unit cycles off there is not any draw.
(3rd posting)


and weight and cost/ this is what a operator wants and these are the people that purchase the products o yes and a decent back up service that includes a reasonable price and time to get parts this is zanotties downfall parts are murder and next week will do?
There is a reason Zanotti leaves the OE manufacturers label on the part. It is so you are not completely Dependant on Zanotti for the parts. TK Zanotti or Carrier we all use the same danfoss, kidwell, or sporland part. the only difference being is Zanotti does not scrape off the sporland number on that drier that They labeled a 61-0800. you have the sporland number written on that drier so you can go to your local refrigeration supply house and buy an OEM drier. Or use the 0800 to replace the old Zanotti one. The only thing captive to Zanotti are the electronics body panels, and coil configurations.

Any tech worth his salt can source parts and fix these units. If you need tech support the come here and post the question.



its to the point in our neck of the woods no Zanotti's go on critical loads.

Things change. Here where the Zanotti name and product has support, The equipment is taking market share. The refrigeration customers in this market finally have a choice. From strawberries to Shu shi grade tuna Zanotti is like any other.

ZoO
31-01-2011, 11:16 PM
have read all with interest the moral of our story in the uk is keep it for 3 years then ditch it quick, or have deep pockets very deep pockets parts i believe they think of a number and trebble it back up nill nothing at all the units in my opinion are trouble and before someone jumps on me back and tells me there ok like everyone you get good and bad but fron our side which is a engineers side they are bad news

I would say that three years is the complete life span of any unit not being properly maintained.

abbsnowman
01-02-2011, 05:56 AM
Zoo, my hat is off to you. Good on you for not only standing up for what you believe but backing it with knowlage.
Watch out guys. I have to agree with Zoo.... Zanotti is serious about the transport market and are proving it with the fact that not only are they still here, they are making improvments and introducing inovation to the market.
I have friends that sell this product and swear by it. I sold it when they first came over and it was not good for me. The wounds have healed and surprisingly, I find myself interested and watching cloesly again. I would not have believed it myself.
They are serious folks. Time to pay attention!

charlie patt
01-02-2011, 09:38 AM
once bitten twice shy i am only speaking of the uk market and how we find it,a 12 month test of a zanottie on twelve trucks over twelve months in 2008 by a major retailer in the uk found a 16 percent fuel increase on there drops and downtime of 22.1 percent more compared to a carrier that they where running at the same time as far as spsres go yes most are shared but 3 of our major suppliers insist on genuine manfactuer spares wheather its a danfoss or no and where fo you sugest i go for a small pcb makro? i was also quoted more for a small dc motor than a micro for a carrier our biggest problem is lack of support in this economy no one is running spare trucks if we get the time we can fix what ever comes to us but technical here is a waste of time and i am not just zanottie bashing its as it is if you wish to sea the reports i will file them for you ta charlie

willis123
01-02-2011, 11:03 AM
ZoO stands for: Zanotti of Orlando I never said I was not connected to Zanotti in anyway. I only said i am not here to sell anything, just to give facts about the changes being made in this industry. specifically with this product.

That is why I ask for specific models. I have not heard of any nor can I find any when I do a search.


As I said in a full Field situation where maximum draw is being placed on the truck, there is only a 12 hp draw. In normal operation the parasitic draw averages around 6 to 8hp (Depending on box temp and amb temp, and truck.) Overall That is less than the drivers A/C compressor. when the unit cycles off there is not any draw.

Zanotti has skipped fuel savings in favor of no fuel being used to directly power the unit. Not to mention there is nothing to maintain on the unit.

How do these conditions differ from standard cold plate technology? Those systems have been married to trucks for decades.


What is the "new" carrier called? How is it powered? Is it using A/C voltage? Why do you consider this safe and what Zanotti has done unsafe?


time will tell.
In terms of not being able to find any other electric units, check out www.frigoblock.de (http://www.frigoblock.de) they've been selling these in Europe for decades and are well respected.

ZoO
01-02-2011, 02:05 PM
Zoo, my hat is off to you. Good on you for not only standing up for what you believe but backing it with knowlage.
Watch out guys. I have to agree with Zoo.... Zanotti is serious about the transport market and are proving it with the fact that not only are they still here, they are making improvments and introducing inovation to the market.
I have friends that sell this product and swear by it. I sold it when they first came over and it was not good for me. The wounds have healed and surprisingly, I find myself interested and watching cloesly again. I would not have believed it myself.
They are serious folks. Time to pay attention!

Thank you, and glad to see the support of a heavy hitter on this board!

I too am also a great believer. I have about 50 of these units in my area that I maintain, and honestly do not have the problems others seem to have. but again I maintain the equiptment.

One other little fact Zanotti has been in the refrigeration business well over 60 years they have deep pockets, and as wittnessed by the entire line change they are not afraid of spending money to improve the equiptment or our ablity to service the equiptment as per the 9 day Zanotti training school I just completed. As you said and despite the rumors Zanotti is not going anywhere... but up.

ZoO
01-02-2011, 02:25 PM
[QUOTE]once bitten twice shy i am only speaking of the uk market and how we find it,a 12 month test of a zanottie on twelve trucks over twelve months in 2008 by a major retailer in the uk found a 16 percent fuel increase on there drops and downtime of 22.1 percent more compared to a carrier that they where running at the same time
What model Zanotti units where they? Direct drive diesel??


as far as spsres go yes most are shared but 3 of our major suppliers insist on genuine manufacturer spares weather its a danfoss or no and where fo you suggest i go for a small pcb makro? i was also quoted more for a small dc motor than a micro for a carrier
Our latest controller lists for 220.00 dollars compared to 850.00 from TK. if your paying more too much more then that, then report your local dealer to Zanotti corp. As far as OE parts are concerned, The OE distributor Is Not The OEM. Thermo King does not make it's own driers solenoids, valves, engines etc.. Neither does carrier, and neither to we. So by leaving the actual OEM part number on the part you can by pass the OE distributor and directly buy an OEM part. Unlike you can with carrier or TK. There you can only buy a private labeled OE parts. (You are actually paying for their name)



our biggest problem is lack of support in this economy no one is running spare trucks if we get the time we can fix what ever comes to us but technical here is a waste of time and i am not just zanottie bashing its as it is if you wish to sea the reports i will file them for you ta charlie

I can also produce invoices that shows an incredible track record for these units. Some 7 or more years old.

The equipment is not bullet proof. System performance will always be reflect the level of support the equipment receives. This is true no matter what brand of equipment you service.

ZoO
01-02-2011, 02:30 PM
In terms of not being able to find any other electric units, check out www.frigoblock.de (http://www.frigoblock.de) they've been selling these in Europe for decades and are well respected.

What powers the unit?

willis123
01-02-2011, 07:27 PM
3 phase alternators from 6kVA to 24kVA powered by the truck engine.

Govet is another one, they use generators from 10kVA to 30kVA.

www.goverset.nl (http://www.goverset.nl)

djbe
01-02-2011, 08:49 PM
And the NEW Uno replaces the DFZ's above the 435, that included the Perkins engine, with a direct drive Yanmar engine coupled straight to a bock compressor. (The unit only has one belt)


To be fair ZoO I have found your posts in this thread very interesting and informative.

It doesn't mean I am going to start singing the praise for their diesel units until I have seen it for myself (that perkins engine was a pile of crap;)) but it does sound like they are moving in the right direction.

What has intrigued me is your comment above regarding the new Yanmar engine / Bock Compressor.

How exactly are they coupled together?

Regards,
djbe.

charlie patt
01-02-2011, 09:43 PM
quote 1 direct drives quote 2 parts supplies there is one suppler in uk that is worth there salt and cost ? well we can all pluck a price and find something on another firm dearer if we look hard enough at least we can get most makes parts next day ordered my last zanottie parts last friday and where is it? finished work today at 8 pm still no bits probable sea them thursday and if you can speak to zanottie corp good luck because they are not to cocerned about us quote 3 reliability a fridge unit at 7 yearsold and still running thats hardly anything to shout about today i was working on a 1986 snwd needed a throttleing valve rang tk northern i bet i sea it tomorrow will my zanottie bits be in? no i bet they wont. and yes many parts are individually listed danfoss etc etc and can be crossreferenced but what about the controller board i am waiting for since the 23 of december shall i nock one up from cpc. as far as running costs and fuel etc do you want to sea the independant results over a twelve month test not what comes out of the manufactures brochure and lastly the bock comps one of the best commercial unit we install but those on transport have had ther problems any input on that. i am not a total hatter of zanottie zoo its just in this country they are a pile of c*** ta charlie

ZoO
01-02-2011, 09:51 PM
3 phase alternators from 6kVA to 24kVA powered by the truck engine.

Govet is another one, they use generators from 10kVA to 30kVA.

www.goverset.nl (http://www.goverset.nl)

I sounds as if the European market has embraced this technology already. unfortunately for the Us we do not have as many options. In fact Zanotti's offerings are the only real option available to this market.

djbe
01-02-2011, 09:53 PM
quote 1 direct drives quote 2 parts supplies there is one suppler in uk that is worth there salt and cost ? well we can all pluck a price and find something on another firm dearer if we look hard enough at least we can get most makes parts next day ordered my last zanottie parts last friday and where is it? finished work today at 8 pm still no bits probable sea them thursday and if you can speak to zanottie corp good luck because they are not to cocerned about us quote 3 reliability a fridge unit at 7 yearsold and still running thats hardly anything to shout about today i was working on a 1986 snwd needed a throttleing valve rang tk northern i bet i sea it tomorrow will my zanottie bits be in? no i bet they wont. and yes many parts are individually listed danfoss etc etc and can be crossreferenced but what about the controller board i am waiting for since the 23 of december shall i nock one up from cpc. as far as running costs and fuel etc do you want to sea the independant results over a twelve month test not what comes out of the manufactures brochure and lastly the bock comps one of the best commercial unit we install but those on transport have had ther problems any input on that. i am not a total hatter of zanottie zoo its just in this country they are a pile of c*** ta charlie

Bloomin heck, how about a pause for breath Charlie:D

Again valid points though, I was once told over 2 months for a cab loom! Made one myself in the end with a reel of cable from RS.

Disagree on the Bock compressors though, been dealing with them in transport for years and they are OK.

regards,
djbe.

ZoO
01-02-2011, 09:56 PM
To be fair ZoO I have found your posts in this thread very interesting and informative.

It doesn't mean I am going to start singing the praise for their diesel units until I have seen it for myself (that perkins engine was a pile of crap;)) but it does sound like they are moving in the right direction.

What has intrigued me is your comment above regarding the new Yanmar engine / Bock Compressor.

How exactly are they coupled together?

Regards,
djbe.

It is a mechanical coupler that works sort of like Carrier's nylon gear set, but the gears are steel with a soft alloy shear pin. In testing the 3.74 usually stalls long before the compressor can lock up. if by some chance it does, the shear pin gives way before any real damage occurs.

charlie patt
01-02-2011, 10:08 PM
djbe i must admit on the bocks we have had very little problem except the recalls we done for one manfactuer but i was lead to believe that was human error ie mineral and ester dont mix that was the bus side to. zanotties just make make me a bit insane there reps give it the big heave ho and when it goes wrong they have disapeared. i always embrace change but i do like product support and parts availability. i am used to expensive parts i work on enough carriers i just want the availability the first time i worked on a zanottie i went on the roof and saw the old type york comp, they where good in 1980 but in 2006 they where a bit out of date and the rep is telling us how modern they where? i love my transport and i love my tk carrier gah and hubbard where i can ring up and get parts without haveing to tell a customer i dont know when its comeing. i currentley have a carrier 550 fault but its 1993 so its allowed it, sorted it rung up for pipe thermistor at 545 pm it will be with me by twelve tomoz through carrier and that you cant replace goodnight my head is spinning and of to a breakdown ta charlie

ZoO
01-02-2011, 10:18 PM
[QUOTE]quote 1 direct drives quote 2 parts supplies there is one suppler in uk that is worth there salt and cost ? well we can all pluck a price and find something on another firm dearer if we look hard enough at least we can get most makes parts next day ordered my last zanottie parts last friday and where is it? finished work today at 8 pm still no bits probable sea them thursday
Your local dealer is the last in the chain of several hands part go through before they get to you the end user. If you can not get part through your local dealer then do some research and contact the local or master distributor in your area. Chances are if your having trouble getting part from one specific dealer others are as well. This maybe an opportunity for you to grow your business, unless you are a TK or Carrier dealer already... If you are then know that supplying competing dealers with parts is not a heavy concern for us.. Just like having TK or Carrier supplying me with parts in a timely manner is not keeping anyone awake at night either.



and if you can speak to zanottie corp good luck because they are not to concerned about us If by "us" you mean anyone besides a competing dealer, your are incorrect or simply have approached contacting Zanotti through the wrong channels.


quote 3 reliability a fridge unit at 7 yearsold and still running thats hardly anything to shout about today i was working on a 1986 snwd needed a throttling valve rang tk

SNWD are still around here as well but they are the exception, and not the rule.


northern i bet i sea it tomorrow will my zanottie bits be in? no i bet they wont. Then do something about it.


and yes many parts are individually listed danfoss etc etc and can be cross referenced but what about the controller board i am waiting for since the 23 of December shall i nock one up from cpc.
What's the part number?


as far as running costs and fuel etc do you want to sea the independent results over a twelve month test not what comes out of the manufactures brochure
All I am looking for is a list of units being tested so I can confirm that one the technology is current, and that the units being compared are indeed equal.

Because as I have already mentioned Zanotti has changed all of the Larger diesels over to Yanmar/Isuzu, so fuel consumption will be at what you will find with TK.



and lastly the bock comps one of the best commercial unit we install but those on transport have had ther problems any input on that.

Problems like what exactly? I have 15 that I care for and no problems yet.



i am not a total hatter of zanottie zoo its just in this country they are a pile of c*** ta charlie

You personal preference is of little concern to me one way or another. I am simply here to bring you Zanotti news and answer questions.

ZoO
01-02-2011, 10:27 PM
zanotties just make make me a bit insane there reps give it the big heave ho and when it goes wrong they have disappeared.

Without a doubt we have a stronger sales department than service department. Hopefully we in time can get good a systems of good strong independents to stand behind and service this product.


the first time i worked on a zanottie i went on the roof and saw the old type York comp, they where good in 1980 but in 2006 they where a bit out of date and the rep is telling us how modern they where?
That was probably a DFZ425. The Yorks have been replaced with Sel-Tec TM21s and the Perkins has been replaced with a 2cylinder Kohler/lambordini.


i love my transport and i love my tk carrier gah and hubbard where i can ring up and get parts without haveing to tell a customer i dont know when its comeing. i currentley have a carrier 550 fault but its 1993 so its allowed it, sorted it rung up for pipe thermistor at 545 pm it will be with me by twelve tomoz through carrier and that you cant replace goodnight my head is spinning and of to a breakdown ta charlie

It truly sounds like all you guys need is for one of you to goto Zanotti corp and request/become a local distributor.

djbe
01-02-2011, 10:50 PM
It is a mechanical coupler that works sort of like Carrier's nylon gear set, but the gears are steel with a soft alloy shear pin. In testing the 3.74 usually stalls long before the compressor can lock up. if by some chance it does, the shear pin gives way before any real damage occurs.

That was going to be my next question, has it got a shear pin in case the compressor seizes.

What about electric standby?

regards,
djbe.

ZoO
02-02-2011, 01:42 AM
That was going to be my next question, has it got a shear pin in case the compressor seizes.

What about electric standby?

regards,
djbe.

Standby uses a separate Copeland scroll compressor sized to match the road capacity, so there is no capacity loss when unit goes into standby mode.

willis123
02-02-2011, 04:01 PM
They have been used in Europe for years but always on a low volume basis. The impact on truck fuel consumption is a killer especially in paces like the UK where standard units can run the reefer engine on agricultural tax free red diesel which is 60% cheaper than the truck's white diesel currently selling at $2.10 per litre.

charlie patt
02-02-2011, 07:11 PM
Without a doubt we have a stronger sales department than service department. Hopefully we in time can get good a systems of good strong independents to stand behind and service this product.


That was probably a DFZ425. The Yorks have been replaced with Sel-Tec TM21s and the Perkins has been replaced with a 2cylinder Kohler/lambordini.



It truly sounds like all you guys need is for one of you to goto Zanotti corp and request/become a local distributor.
no thanks we have a good tradeing name and plan to keep it :)

ZoO
02-02-2011, 07:32 PM
They have been used in Europe for years but always on a low volume basis. The impact on truck fuel consumption is a killer especially in paces like the UK where standard units can run the reefer engine on agricultural tax free red diesel which is 60% cheaper than the truck's white diesel currently selling at $2.10 per litre.

Again the average draw is about 8 to 12 hp, the max being 16 on the engine. That means there is less of a draw than what the driver's A/C compressor pulls from the engine.

Now instead of buying red and white diesel, you can completely eliminate the need for filling the second tank all together.

As I said before the all electric unit will not fit every application, that is why Zanotti is producing the direct drive UNO with the Yanmar diesels. (For those who are not ready to make any changes in the way they do business.)

When the market is forced into working with all electric units, we will been the first (In the US market)with a proven technology.

ZoO
02-02-2011, 08:06 PM
no thanks we have a good trading name and plan to keep it :)
Respectfully,

Without a doubt the Transport Refrigeration industry is a Lead, Follow or Get out of the way business. There is nothing wrong with admitting where you feel most comfortable. In fact as I am sure you are well aware one can make a very profitable living simply following the 2 big companies, and picking up their table scraps..

But for those of us who can see a Zanotti franchise for what it is, (A ground floor opportunity to break in this industry when and where positive change is taking place.) It is an chance for the independent to break into the industry and become an actual dealer. Which has the potential for unlimited growth for our companies. Otherwise you can only grow as much as the other two will allow you to. Again if your comfortable where you are, no one is asking you to do or change anything you do not want to change.

charlie patt
02-02-2011, 08:50 PM
well in the uk the big boys are folding daily whist we independands grow day by day and as far as scraps go most dealers will tell you what they get for warrantie work does not pay? why ? because the manufactuer has the power to do what they require maybe when you stop looking through those rose tinted glases you can sea this, maybee the service in the us that zanottie give you is better than uk maybee they have learned there lesson from the uk but i am speaking as a independant not a dealer just a pure independant and over in the uk i have heard this from zanottie year after year, this time we have it right this kit is better we are better than the rest? this time they may be but if the raindrop keeps falling in the same place the hole wears thin. and ps still no zanottie parts today and they come from zanottie themselves not a dealervor a sub but that old tk and carrier up and running parts delivered on time ta charlie

abbsnowman
02-02-2011, 11:51 PM
Is this a good time to bring up Mitsubishi! :o lol

ZoO
03-02-2011, 03:07 AM
[QUOTE]well in the uk the big boys are folding daily whist we independents grow day by day and as far as scraps go most dealers will tell you what they get for warrantie work does not pay? why ?
Who said anything about warranty work being anything thing other than a burden?
I have been an independent for nearly 10 years myself, and I know where the independent shop finds it's limits. We/you are limited to fighting over staying current in the field. you have to rely on stolen software and hacked equipment to just do your job. The scraps I am talking about are the left over manuals we/you fight over on eBay, and photo copy we have to make just so we can keep our doors open. Or the trade we have to make in finding and servicing those customers with SNWD and Thunderbirds, because "we" have do not know how to calibrate an ETV let alone have a lap top to access carrier's equipment. The big guys are doing their best to put you out of business, and all you can say is how terrible Zanotti is for putting parts on a unit you can buy just about anywhere...

All this and we haven't even got to mention Market share. The Selling of equipment and the installation of new equipment and the resale of the trade ins are what is keeping us busy during the slow time we all experience this time of year... Warranty work is just a necessary evil to benefit from all of the other positives we have experienced. Plus we have only had 6 claims all year, so really it is not such a bad trade off. As I said if you can find a niche where you are then you are doing better than most.

Honestly if the market would allow me to remain stagnate in my business I would have done the same. But for me it was not possible. It was either find a way to grow my business or succumb to the economy that has millions looking for a job. As you can tell I do not work well with others, so even if I had a job with carrier, Tk, or a fleet somewhere I most likely would not have it long.


over in the uk i have heard this from zanottie year after year, this time we have it right this kit is better we are better than the rest? this time they may be but if the raindrop keeps falling in the same place the hole wears thin.
Sales without service still equals failure no matter who's name is on the unit. Again your lack of parts points to a need in your specific market for an authorized service center.



and ps still no zanottie parts today and they come from zanottie themselves not a dealervor a sub but that old tk and carrier up and running parts delivered on time ta charlie
What part number are you looking for?

It is easy to say you do not have the part with no one to hold you accountable to your story.

If you do indeed need a part simply give me a part number I could have to you next day if you want to pay freight. I would think an actual dealer would have a better go at getting you parts, (Who is actually apart of the Zanotti network) than you trying to buy parts from the manufacture with whatever weight you think your name carries at the cooperate level.

Or you can continue on claiming anything you wish..
It really does not matter to me, one way or another. Again I am here to simply bring you all some new news in the industry and to straighten out any questions or misconceptions about the equipment, or in your case service part availability.

ZoO
03-02-2011, 03:08 AM
Is this a good time to bring up Mitsubishi! :o lol
Do they make any reefers besides container units?

abbsnowman
03-02-2011, 05:40 AM
Yes they do!
Hey Zoo, I have a DFZ430 that I'm sending to scrap. (I may have 2. Not sure if my other one has been picked up from storage yet.) Do you want anything off it beofre it goes to reefer heaven? Cab Controll is gone.
Maybe you should PM me at mark@futureclimates.ca so we can "chat."

charlie patt
03-02-2011, 08:10 PM
[quote=charlie patt;221101]
Who said anything about warranty work being anything thing other than a burden?
I have been an independent for nearly 10 years myself, and I know where the independent shop finds it's limits. We/you are limited to fighting over staying current in the field. you have to rely on stolen software and hacked equipment to just do your job. The scraps I am talking about are the left over manuals we/you fight over on eBay, and photo copy we have to make just so we can keep our doors open. Or the trade we have to make in finding and servicing those customers with SNWD and Thunderbirds, because "we" have do not know how to calibrate an ETV let alone have a lap top to access carrier's equipment. The big guys are doing their best to put you out of business, and all you can say is how terrible Zanotti is for putting parts on a unit you can buy just about anywhere...

All this and we haven't even got to mention Market share. The Selling of equipment and the installation of new equipment and the resale of the trade ins are what is keeping us busy during the slow time we all experience this time of year... Warranty work is just a necessary evil to benefit from all of the other positives we have experienced. Plus we have only had 6 claims all year, so really it is not such a bad trade off. As I said if you can find a niche where you are then you are doing better than most.

Honestly if the market would allow me to remain stagnate in my business I would have done the same. But for me it was not possible. It was either find a way to grow my business or succumb to the economy that has millions looking for a job. As you can tell I do not work well with others, so even if I had a job with carrier, Tk, or a fleet somewhere I most likely would not have it long.


Sales without service still equals failure no matter who's name is on the unit. Again your lack of parts points to a need in your specific market for an authorized service center.

What part number are you looking for?

It is easy to say you do not have the part with no one to hold you accountable to your story.

If you do indeed need a part simply give me a part number I could have to you next day if you want to pay freight. I would think an actual dealer would have a better go at getting you parts, (Who is actually apart of the Zanotti network) than you trying to buy parts from the manufacture with whatever weight you think your name carries at the cooperate level.

Or you can continue on claiming anything you wish..
It really does not matter to me, one way or another. Again I am here to simply bring you all some new news in the industry and to straighten out any questions or misconceptions about the equipment, or in your case service part availability.
six failures in a year is that zanottie faiures or generally and is that over the last twelve months or since january the first. your competition maybee tring to limit there spec to you but i can sea why if you defend one company like you do but i admire that. over here tk and carrier gah and hubbard tech is easy the only problems i have had is getting rid of software for a old unit on a carrier i should of kept :rolleyes: but i did not think there was any left ,and when my parts turn up i will put the part numbers on the screen for you to sea if we can arange a better parts service my last pice of advise before i go to another call is everything in a sales maual is not always spot on ta charlie

NoNickName
03-02-2011, 08:49 PM
Just to make sure everybody knows: Hubbard is Zanotti.

ZoO
03-02-2011, 09:41 PM
[quote=ZoO;221144]
[QUOTE]six failures in a year is that zanottie faiures or generally and is that over the last twelve months or since January the first.
In the states when some one references a year they mean 365 days from that day. From Jan 1 to current would be represented as: YTD Year to Date.


your competition maybee tring to limit there spec to you but i can sea why if you defend one company like you do but i admire that.
Again in the states TK and Carrier both limit access manuals and software to all non dealer shops.


over here tk and carrier gah and hubbard tech is easy the only problems i have had is getting rid of software for a old unit on a carrier i should of kept :rolleyes: but i did not think there was any leftI know someone else has already burst your bubble, but here is a link confirming hubbard's buy out by Zanotti.. Maybe you can look to them for Zanotti parts in your area.
http://www.hubbard.co.uk/products/newsarticle6.php


,and when my parts turn up i will put the part numbers on the screen for you to sea if we can arange a better parts service my last pice of advise before i go to another call
ok?



is everything in a sales maual is not always spot on ta charlie

Not sure what this means

charlie patt
03-02-2011, 10:12 PM
[quote=charlie patt;221239][quote=ZoO;221144]

In the states when some one references a year they mean 365 days from that day. From Jan 1 to current would be represented as: YTD Year to Date.


Again in the states TK and Carrier both limit access manuals and software to all non dealer shops.

I know someone else has already burst your bubble, but here is a link confirming hubbard's buy out by Zanotti.. Maybe you can look to them for Zanotti parts in your area.
http://www.hubbard.co.uk/products/newsarticle6.php


ok?


Not sure what this means
no bubble bursting hear i pressumed that log was for you thats how bad zanottie is here you ring hubbard and speak to mel in parts for hubbard bits no problem next day there it is you ring for zanottie parts you still get mel but life it not as easy? eta not sure availability ? not yet ?cost? omg and as far as the sales pitch that what your blog sounds like try it cut the 500 word responses and ring them its 01473890522 plus your international call find the cost find the availlability and then respond just come back of call working on a lovelly 460 no problem there but me zanotties? still awaiting bits one day they will land and i will tell the customer a lovely man from the states cannot understand the delay you explain to them next time

willis123
03-02-2011, 11:21 PM
Again the average draw is about 8 to 12 hp, the max being 16 on the engine. That means there is less of a draw than what the driver's A/C compressor pulls from the engine.

Now instead of buying red and white diesel, you can completely eliminate the need for filling the second tank all together.

As I said before the all electric unit will not fit every application, that is why Zanotti is producing the direct drive UNO with the Yanmar diesels. (For those who are not ready to make any changes in the way they do business.)

When the market is forced into working with all electric units, we will been the first (In the US market)with a proven technology.
Looks like you really have struck gold if this is the case but let's remember watts do not come free. The suggestion that a unit that has the ability to freeze the cargo area of a mid weight truck will have the same impact as a cab air con unit is a tad fanciful. A typical 18t distribution truck in the UK runs at between 180 to 220hp so the 16% suggested impact is approaching a 10% loss.

Every 1 mile per gallon lost in consumption is the equivalent of circa $4,200 lost per annum when white diesel is retailing at $9.95 a gallon as it is currently.

Granted the economics may be different in other countries but this explains one of the main reasons why the majority of users in the UK prefer to stick with a red tank, fuel that's circa 60% cheaper and a separate small capacity diesel.

ZoO
04-02-2011, 03:39 AM
Looks like you really have struck gold if this is the case but let's remember watts do not come free. The suggestion that a unit that has the ability to freeze the cargo area of a mid weight truck will have the same impact as a cab air con unit is a tad fanciful. A typical 18t distribution truck in the UK runs at between 180 to 220hp so the 16% suggested impact is approaching a 10% loss.

Every 1 mile per gallon lost in consumption is the equivalent of circa $4,200 lost per annum when white diesel is retailing at $9.95 a gallon as it is currently.

Granted the economics may be different in other countries but this explains one of the main reasons why the majority of users in the UK prefer to stick with a red tank, fuel that's circa 60% cheaper and a separate small capacity diesel.

Let's take an honest look at the math, 8 to 16 hp from a 220 hp engine comes out to less than a 4 to 8% parasitic draw which on the high end is half of 16% of the total power produced by the truck's engine. (I guess the teach a different kind of math where you live.) Realistically we are looking at 5% draw near set point and absolutely no draw at set point (unless the evap fans are programed to run)

That is comparable to the .5 to .8 gallons per hour it take to run the typical Yanmar or kobuto engines. Not to mention:

As I said before the all electric unit will not fit every application, that is why Zanotti is producing the direct drive UNO with the Yanmar diesels. (For those who are not ready to make any changes in the way they do business.)

When the market is forced into working with all electric units, we will been the first (In the US market)with a proven technology

I do agree we have indeed struck Gold!! Not in that we have placed all of our eggs in one electric basket, but Zanotti has the flexibility to offer the EFZ's to customers who are looking for an environmentally friendly solutions, or Yanmar Diesels to those who are stuck in the way they are currently doing business.

Like the Idea or not you guys are about to see a bunch of them over there, if you live or work next to one of the more popular fast food joints. They don't seem to be too put off by the max potential of an 8% power loss when compared to the annual cost of fueling and Maintenance of the conventional reefer.

(..Did I mention there isn't any maintenance other than the PTO belt (35.00) and a drier (50.00) once a year.)

ZoO
04-02-2011, 03:46 AM
[quote=ZoO;221256][quote=charlie patt;221239]
no bubble bursting hear i presumed that log was for you thats how bad zanottie is here you ring hubbard and speak to mel in parts for hubbard bits no problem next day there it is you ring for zanottie parts you still get mel but life it not as easy? eta not sure availability ? not yet ?cost? omg and as far as the sales pitch that what your blog sounds like try it cut the 500 word responses and ring them its 01473890522 plus your international call find the cost find the availability and then respond just come back of call working on a lovelly 460 no problem there but me zanotties? still awaiting bits one day they will land and i will tell the customer a lovely man from the states cannot understand the delay you explain to them next time

Not sure what your saying? Do you want me to call someone? about what? did you ever find me those part numbers?

You are aware that Zanotti/hubbard are indeed the same company?

Again not sure what your asking. maybe space out your actual requests from your general thoughts might help..:confused:

willis123
04-02-2011, 07:26 AM
Let's take an honest look at the math, 8 to 16 hp from a 220 hp engine comes out to less than a 4 to 8% parasitic draw which on the high end is half of 16% of the total power produced by the truck's engine. (I guess the teach a different kind of math where you live.) Realistically we are looking at 5% draw near set point and absolutely no draw at set point (unless the evap fans are programed to run)

That is comparable to the .5 to .8 gallons per hour it take to run the typical Yanmar or kobuto engines. Not to mention:

As I said before the all electric unit will not fit every application, that is why Zanotti is producing the direct drive UNO with the Yanmar diesels. (For those who are not ready to make any changes in the way they do business.)

When the market is forced into working with all electric units, we will been the first (In the US market)with a proven technology

I do agree we have indeed struck Gold!! Not in that we have placed all of our eggs in one electric basket, but Zanotti has the flexibility to offer the EFZ's to customers who are looking for an environmentally friendly solutions, or Yanmar Diesels to those who are stuck in the way they are currently doing business.

Like the Idea or not you guys are about to see a bunch of them over there, if you live or work next to one of the more popular fast food joints. They don't seem to be too put off by the max potential of an 8% power loss when compared to the annual cost of fueling and Maintenance of the conventional reefer.

(..Did I mention there isn't any maintenance other than the PTO belt (35.00) and a drier (50.00) once a year.)
Not much I can add to that. A unit that uses no fuel and costs $85 a year to maintain which the market will be 'forced' into taking. Let's watch this space with interest.

charlie patt
04-02-2011, 07:09 PM
[quote=charlie patt;221262][quote=ZoO;221256]

Not sure what your saying? Do you want me to call someone? about what? did you ever find me those part numbers?

You are aware that Zanotti/hubbard are indeed the same company?

Again not sure what your asking. maybe space out your actual requests from your general thoughts might help..:confused:
the reason for me printing this number is to show you hubbard and zanottie are the same group in the uk even the same parts person mel is his name you can ring him up should you wish and try, the difference being if you ring for hubbard spares no problem on there way if you ring up for zanottie spares ah um the usual replie from him is are you sitting down and well we will have to get it in he is a great guy but zanottie made such a mess of the uk they bought hubbard out to give them a fresh start 2 to 3 years ago and there parts are still slow and costly if so many bits are as you say made from various manufactueres why do zanottie increase the price so much they are makeing carriers look cheap at mo, the parts i am waiting for will be with me next week when i get them i will post the part numbers its a loom and a pcb the loom on order since before christmas i still dont like zanotties to many broken promises year after year and until i jump on one and thing thats a good idea have a decent parts base and cost effective parts i wont i am afraid :)

ZoO
04-02-2011, 09:03 PM
[quote=ZoO;221316][quote=charlie patt;221262]
[QUOTE]the reason for me printing this number is to show you hubbard and zanottie are the same group in the uk even the same parts person mel is his name you can ring him up should you wish and try, the difference being if you ring for hubbard spares no problem on there way if you ring up for zanottie spares ah um the usual replie from him is are you sitting down and well we will have to get it in he is a great guy but zanottie made such a mess of the uk they bought hubbard out to give them a fresh start 2 to 3 years ago and there parts are still slow and costly if so many bits are as you say made from various
This is a dealer issue not a factory issue. if a stocking dealer does not have the part it is because that dealer has not bought the part from Zanotti. Not only does the factory stock parts, the master distributors should have parts stocked, and the dealer you buy them from should also have them. if they do not call the master distributor for your area and tell them the actual dealer is not stocking what you need. Again it is not Zanotti's fault that one dealer does not stock what you might need at any given time. If enough complaints go in they will make a change.


manufacturer's why do zanottie increase the price so much they are making carriers look cheap at mo, the parts i am waiting for will be with me next week when i get them i will post the part numbers its a loom and a pcb the loom on order since before christmas
If it is the three wire in-cab "loom" it should cost 63.00 if it is the unica 1 board it should cost 235.00 dollars. We (In the states) have a price sheet that we have to sell buy. We are not allowed to charge more than what is on the sheet. I recently bought an in-cab "loom" and control card for a V-300 and it cost me 870.00 dollars for the card and 330.00 for the cable/loom. These are comparable components for basically the same size unit. If your paying too much more that what I listed for the Zanotti parts then make a complaint. As I said there are very tight regulations (With us) that do not allow for many dissatisfied customers. Perhaps it is different over there.



i still dont like zanotties to many broken promises year after year and until i jump on one and thing thats a good idea have a decent parts base and cost effective parts i wont i am afraid :)


I agree until we get a better network of dealers we will continue to struggle with fear of the product. I have seen what this product can do when cared for by the proper people. I can attest that There is nothing to fear from the product..

ZoO
04-02-2011, 09:30 PM
Not much I can add to that. A unit that uses no fuel and costs $85 a year to maintain which the market will be 'forced' into taking. Let's watch this space with interest.

In this last sales meeting, we were told a large rental fleet in Ca. Took several trucks equipped with the EFZ/Aura unit and placed them in service with their various fleets. Then We were shown an internal memo that places operating cost of a comparable diesel @ $1.85 per hour (Including maintenance) to the EFZ at .17 cents per hour... Granted they only ran the units for a couple of months, but they were sufficiently impressed to want to add more to their fleet when we went into full production.

I agree it all sounds alittle too amazing, and I was skeptical at first myself, but after hearing testimonies, and testing and tinkering with one of these trucks most of last week I am sold on the idea.. I will say, time will tell. They seem to be hitting the European markets in greater numbers, so some of you will get to see them before I will, in larger numbers.

We have 5 aura systems placed on cold plate trucks here, they were alittle buggy at first, but now they seem to be working out well. With the Aura paired with Zanotti's EFZ (a unit designed to work specifically with the Aura system) they should be a long lasting piece of equipment. Again, time will tell.

charlie patt
04-02-2011, 09:35 PM
we dont have dealers just the one supplier hubbard/zanottie and they dont carry enough zanparts this is the manufactuer itself not a dealer just as reference do you have the fridges with the little dc motor that drives straight to a comp on a roof of a van usually the small vans by any chance

clivemtk
04-02-2011, 10:19 PM
excuse me but thermoking already have a all electric units ta1050 and 1100 just to put record right

willis123
05-02-2011, 01:46 AM
In this last sales meeting, we were told a large rental fleet in Ca. Took several trucks equipped with the EFZ/Aura unit and placed them in service with their various fleets. Then We were shown an internal memo that places operating cost of a comparable diesel @ $1.85 per hour (Including maintenance) to the EFZ at .17 cents per hour... Granted they only ran the units for a couple of months, but they were sufficiently impressed to want to add more to their fleet when we went into full production.

I agree it all sounds alittle too amazing, and I was skeptical at first myself, but after hearing testimonies, and testing and tinkering with one of these trucks most of last week I am sold on the idea.. I will say, time will tell. They seem to be hitting the European markets in greater numbers, so some of you will get to see them before I will, in larger numbers.

We have 5 aura systems placed on cold plate trucks here, they were alittle buggy at first, but now they seem to be working out well. With the Aura paired with Zanotti's EFZ (a unit designed to work specifically with the Aura system) they should be a long lasting piece of equipment. Again, time will tell.
You are right time will tell and positive innovation at any level is something to be applauded. Product semantics aside however, the critical success factor and what has let Zanotti down so badly in the past in the UK market at least has been service support. With this in mind when a product cost just $85 a year to maintain and the manufacturer actively encourages customers to go straight to the source suppliers for spares as per the claims in previous threads, I can't see service agents tripping over themselves to sign up.

ZoO
05-02-2011, 04:26 AM
we dont have dealers just the one supplier hubbard/zanottie and they dont carry enough zanparts this is the manufacture itself not a dealer just as reference do you have the fridges with the little dc motor that drives straight to a comp on a roof of a van usually the small vans by any chance

It's not a supplier problem I can assure you. We have absolutely no problem getting parts here. If you are then someone is bottle necking for whatever reason..

The Fz114 is our most popular battery unit, but we also have an F-10 and an F-10D that also is a 12 volt system.. I know over there we have larger capacity 24 volt systems as well. Except for the 24 they all use the same motor number.

Matter of fact i sold a motor and a belt earlier today it retails for about 830.00 the belt is 20.00TK's version for the B-100(motor) is 1200.00 I had to buy one this time last year.

ZoO
05-02-2011, 04:29 AM
excuse me but thermo king already have a all electric units ta1050 and 1100 just to put record right


If you goggle those unit model numbers your post is the only thing that comes up relevant to this topic. What are those units supposed to be containers? How are they powered?

ZoO
05-02-2011, 04:42 AM
You are right time will tell and positive innovation at any level is something to be applauded. Product semantics aside however, the critical success factor and what has let Zanotti down so badly in the past in the UK market at least has been service support. With this in mind when a product cost just $85 a year to maintain and the manufacturer actively encourages customers to go straight to the source suppliers for spares as per the claims in previous threads, I can't see service agents tripping over themselves to sign up.

I am not here to recruit anyone to sign up.. I have only ever pointed out opportunities, and corrected rumor and misunderstanding about the product.

I have been told that all Zanotti markets are structured in a similar fashion. They all have regional master distributors, local dealers and sub dealers.

I do not know the specific of what is happening over there, but is sounds as if someone simply does not want the product to succeed in that market for whatever reason, whether that be on a personal/industry level reason, or whether it be an actual effort implemented by a company who has been bought out by a larger company and is desperately trying to retain market share...

Whatever the case it sounds as if you market is ripe for change. If a person were so inclined and had some start up capitol (and were not afraid of a being the kid on the play ground who wasn't wearing the cool shoes.) He could make Himself alot of money.

Again whether this specific product is an instant success or not we have a completely new line of redesigned conventional equipment, that people around here love.

Am I allowed to show pics yet?

abbsnowman
05-02-2011, 06:25 AM
We have a "DC" unit made here in Canada too. Works great in the right aplication.
Zoo, go ahead and post pictures. I would like to see them.
I have a great friend in California that waves the flag and I have to be honest, I am watching close. I was part of phase 1 of Zanotti coming to North America and I have to say, the reputation is not good here. Having said that, the reason was not the product itself but the poor people who were representing the product. Again, I am not quite ready to stake my reputation yet but, I am paying attention now.....

djbe
05-02-2011, 06:41 PM
excuse me but thermoking already have a all electric units ta1050 and 1100 just to put record right

I thought they crashed and burned with those clive? Are they still making them?

regards,
djbe.

djbe
05-02-2011, 06:55 PM
(..Did I mention there isn't any maintenance other than the PTO belt (35.00) and a drier (50.00) once a year.)

You have to be choose yours words carefully dealing with customers over here. Tell them that and the first time anything breaks they will throw it right back at you.:D

I don't think you have fully grasped the arrangement with Zanotti over here in the UK with regard to agents / dealers etc.

Zanotti actually has a presence in the UK via Hubbard that it bought out a few years ago. If anybody wants spares they go direct to Hubbard/Zanotti which is what charliepatt is talking about.

So the problem is that Zanotti themselves (in the UK) don't keep proper spares backup for their diesel units.

If Zanotti aren't worried about keeping spares on the shelf how can they expect subdealers to invest?

The other problem is that Hubbard/Zanotti have their own engineers to cover the UK. If you are a subdealer you don't get an area that is exclusively yours, there is nothing to stop Hubbard/Zanotti signing up the customers in your area and you would just get the scraps when they cannot cope.

Until that changes it will be very difficult to persuade independents that it is worth getting involved and putting some investment in.

regards,
djbe.

ZoO
05-02-2011, 08:51 PM
[QUOTE]You have to be choose yours words carefully dealing with customers over here. Tell them that and the first time anything breaks they will throw it right back at you.:DRegardless if anything breaks or not, these maintenance costs remain a constant from year to year. no one is representing that these will be the only cost you will ever incur over the life span of the unit.



I don't think you have fully grasped the arrangement with Zanotti over here in the UK with regard to agents / dealers etc.
I never said I did. I have only ever represented how we do things, and told all of you how we were told things are done.



Zanotti actually has a presence in the UK via Hubbard that it bought out a few years ago. If anybody wants spares they go direct to Hubbard/Zanotti which is what charliepatt is talking about.
I understood as much


So the problem is that Zanotti themselves (in the UK) don't keep proper spares backup for their diesel units.(This is all speculation:)That's just it. Why would company "A" keep Zanotti parts when they are trying to retain market share? If they can show Zanotti corporate that the market still will not support Zanotti in favor of Company "A" equipment, then they ensure that things do not change at least for a while.



If Zanotti aren't worried about keeping spares on the shelf how can they expect sub dealers to invest?
Zanotti may own the name but they do not own the individual dealers themselves. I am sure there are some corporate dealerships, but not all who fly a Zanotti flag are indeed owned by Zanotti.

It would be like if Zanotti bought TK from IR. The individual TK dealers would make Zanotti a hard sell if for no other reason than to not get stuck with dead inventory and the units that they currently own. If and when the local dealers get rid of all of the old TK stuff and begin to buy new and they are equally invested in parts, equipment and training as they where in their old TK dealerships, then one would expect to see a paradigm shift in the attitudes of those supplying the parts and equipment. But until your market embraces the new Zanotti equipment like it does the old stuff, Zanotti is forced to maintain and produce the old stuff, (to at least some degree) or loose valuable market share. Which again would be in the best interest of the existing dealers of the old stuff.. at least for a while..



The other problem is that Hubbard/Zanotti have their own engineers to cover the UK. If you are a sub dealer you don't get an area that is exclusively yours, there is nothing to stop Hubbard/Zanotti signing up the customers in your area and you would just get the scraps when they cannot cope.
The same is true here this is why one buys a franchise and sets up his own protected dealership, Like Zanotti of Oklahoma city. Then the owner has the authority to set up his own sub-dealers anywhere in his protected area.



Until that changes it will be very difficult to persuade independents that it is worth getting involved and putting some investment in.
Without a doubt, I am sure that perception of the product and the way the product is brought to market is doing alot of damage there

djbe
05-02-2011, 09:32 PM
ZoO, interesting response.

I am sure from what you say that there are significant differences between the US and UK in this area.

Needless to say you are obviously knowledgeable with regards to your market and I wish you all the best in the future.

regards,
djbe.

ZoO
06-02-2011, 02:37 AM
If any of you need help or tech support let me know. I will try and check back as my schedule will allow.

And I am gathering pics and hope to have them all soon.

ruzgar78
07-04-2011, 10:01 PM
everybody hello
i am electronic engineer
the Zanotti control card unit for 2 years are designed and assembled. In general, Zanotti s control cards, problem with the years of my customers has designed a module that I have not received any complaints about it if you want you can help both thermoking for both the carrier and zanottiler
best regards
ali_ruzgar78@hotmail.com
aliruzgar.fartec@gmail.com