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View Full Version : The European Commission proposal for a revision to F-gas







hookster
16-02-2013, 10:51 AM
http://www.epeeglobal.org/epeedocs/internet/docs/EPEE_-FGas_-_position_on_the_review_-_European_Commission-_September_2012-_Final_6957.pdf

Under the existing F Gas regulation, a site would simply have to calculate what Kg refrigerant charge they have, to know what leak detection frequencies/requirements applied.

Under the new proposal, they now have to factor in the GWP and make a calculation relative to CO2 equivalent for emissions.

Leak Testing Frequencies Under new F Gas Proposal
GWP equivalent to 500 tonnes or more CO2 (Mandatory Leak check every 3 months plus MUST have fixed leak detection system
GWP equivalent to between 50-500 tonnes CO2 (Mandatory Leak check every 6 months)
GWP equivalent to between 5-50 tonnes CO2 (Mandatory Leak check every 12 months)




C
GWP
GWP equivalent to between 5-50 tonnes CO2
(Mandatory Leak check every 12 months)
GWP equivalent to between 50-500 tonnes CO2
(Mandatory Leak check every 6 months)
GWP equivalent to 500 tonnes or more CO2(Mandatory Leak check every 3 months plus
MUST have fixed leak detection system)


R404a
3,920
1.3kg
13kg
130kg


R410a
1,610
3kg
30kg
300kg


R417a
1,950
2.5kg
25kg
250kg


R422d
2,624
1.9kg
19kg
190kg


R134a
1,430
3.5kg
35kg
350kg


R407a
1,990
2.5kg
25kg
250kg


R407c
1,600
3kg
30kg
300kg


R407f
1,705
2.9kg
29kg
290kg


R507
3,298
1.5kg
15kg
150kg











The use of refrigerants such as R404a as a retrofit for R22 has always been a very poor choice and with proposed regulation changes customers will be questioning the ethics of these replacements.The GWP of R404A at 3920 is the highest of all the commonly used refrigerants.

Tesla
16-02-2013, 11:33 AM
These rules should have been around for the likes of R12, R502 and R22 20+ years ago to prevent waste. As for GWP and ODP they have no factual proof and a lot of info against their profit making ventures. I know the rules and laws in general about handling, venting or leaking refrigerant but in my mind even if they were right I could not agree with them (history said they lied) - how could they know, they are simply guessing. Science has proven it's self wrong to benefit the so called rich and powerful too many times. It was these people who made us use the refrigerants listed above. For all we know they are holding on to the secrets that water is the best refrigerant. Scientists who are found to lie in the past should be punished like criminals and put in jail along with the politicians. I may sound quite cynical but just look at the rate of waste with new refrigerants where if they lose 20% of a charge - the rest must be wasted.

hookster
16-02-2013, 11:46 AM
Hi Tesla
Your views are definitely appreciated and in the refrigeration industry am I cynical to say but patents from large refrigerant manufacturers have a large impact on decision making from countries where GDP is affected from revenue earned.
The new trend towards CO2 Blends will be interesting and a nightmare for service!
http://www.acr-news.com/news/news.asp?id=3160&title=Chemical+companies+consider+HFO%2FCO2+blends
(Respect to Mercedes Benz for fighting mobile air conditioning trends towards R1234YF)

I just wanted to update users on changes that will affect us from 2020.

Like you I have views and my strongest is natural refrigerants.
http://www.R718.com is a site dedicated towards water vapour as a refrigerant and some large manufacturers on the global reduction in R&D budgets are still putting some development towards this.
http://www.r718.com/news/view/3522

Tesla
16-02-2013, 11:26 PM
Thank you hookster
I also think there should be a paper record which is regularly audited of every gram of refrigerant from the manufacturer to the end use. All bottles of refrigerant should have a date of purchase, who and how much went into each unit on what site (dated). This data would give us a much better picture of which refrigerants are a waste. I very much dislike R410a from experience on how much was wasted on a large site last year and the costs involved, much of it went back to suppliers for destruction. I think all refrigerants should be cleaned and reused rather than destroyed. Thank for keeping us up to date on new policies coming in to place. There should also be a national register of use of all refrigerants so as countries can be compared too. We look a co2 as a good one but really what environment resources are used to make the stuff as to its GWP and ODP.

chilliwilly
17-02-2013, 12:35 PM
I think the REFCOM Elite (UK) have a system like that. But I don't know if its for every gram? You would have to have an expensive set of scales to measure the next decimal place. Maybe just around the corner though, to outdate your existing equipment so you have to buy new!