.need advice in selecting replacement compressor

[expert87]

Hi;

I'm working as a production manager in an Aluminum company.
I've noticed lately that there is water coming out mixed with the air from the air compressor.
turned out our air dryer (from ALUP), has failed due to compressor failure, and the compressor should be changed.

now with my simple knowledge as an industrial Engineer:
1- the dryer compressor number is TFH4525Z , the local distributor is asking for 3000$ to replace it which is ridiculously expensive, so I pulled out some specs on the compressor and this is what I found:
http://www2.renkulde.no/MKDokume.nsf/08B9FAC5D9DFF103C125696F00311281/$FILE/226EU-T.pdf

2- we've been offered the following replacements from the local market:
A- TFH2480Z specs (http://www2.renkulde.no/MKDokume.nsf/7CA729E0B559EE01C1256AE200492505/$FILE/126GU-T.pdf)
B- TFH2511Z (http://www2.renkulde.no/MKDokume.nsf/CD155B0A2F808B15C1256AE20049499A/$FILE/126LU-K.pdf)
I checked those too with the little knowledge I have, they don't match up with the BTU/h or the watts consumption with the original one.

3- I found the same compressor "I think" on the following page:
http://elgracool.pl/product-eng-311-Compressor-L-Unite-Hermetique-TFH4524Z.html
the price is less than 1000$ !

now, I'm confused, are the local market compressors enough for the job? (the salesmen did confirm that buy I highly doubt it) , if not, is the 3rd option compressor enough "is it the same compressor as the original? )

Hope I can find some help;

[r.bartlett]

You need the correct one so no/3 is the way to go.. Who is going to change it out for you?



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[monkey spanners]

Based on the option three model, and the price i'd pay for one here, and a best and worst case (haven't seen the machine or your site) i expect it would be between $2500 and $3200 if i was doing a similar job here for one of my customers, allowing for travel etc.

Are there any other parts that need changing that is in the price? Filters, fans, txv's, epr's, heat exchangers etc? that may have led to the failure and need changing?

It might be worth pricing up a new air drier for comparisson.

[expert87]

Thanks for you replies,

There are no other jobs included, just bringing the compressor from the mother company and installing it.
I have a technician who can do the job, but he doesn't know specs and details.(basic welding).

what we have is an ALUP air dryer, at a second look, some specs are different than what I found for the compressor!
link to dryer manual:
http://www.mediafire.com/?mwifawy6ae7y13x

specs found in the manual:
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/9106/50679139.png


compressor label:
http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/2567/26427617.png
http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/853/40904017.png


Dryer label:
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/1517/67723191.png

now, after these extra information, do any of the local candidate qualify?
is there any trusted website to get the compressor from?

[r.bartlett]

I think you are trying to reinvent the wheel. The compressor as per it's data tag is the correct one. Get a professional company in to fit it. Anything else won't work, it must be done correctly by a qualified engineer. Changing the compressor isn't a simple job if done properly

[expert87]

It is not an issue of getting a fit person to work on the job (I can get someone expert to do it)....I just need a confirmed opinion regarding compressor choice.

I would like someone experienced to compare -if possible- between the choices in my first post (choices 2 & 3) with the original compressor provided in my last post..

[Scramjetman]

You do need a correct diagnosis on the failure. Compressors just don't break for no reason. Something else is amiss and the replacement compressor will go the same way as the first in short order if it is not found.

As far as comparing choices - it's a big ask when all we see is the compressor and don't really know anything about the engineering in the rest of the system. If its a custom built device, or a custom application, and the engineering was less than ordinary, something as simple as a badly mismatched compressor and evaporator pair without adequate load limiting controls can send the compressor to St Peter.

I know it sounds tempting to go the most inexpensive route but cost is a minor factor in this game. You would be prudent in having an experienced mechanic cast a weather eye over the system with a view to giving you some good advice. A quick, cheap fix can turn nasty after the 2nd and 3rd compressors fail and no-one's figured out why.

An industry professional is a good investment in situations like this.

[expert87]

I understand your point completely, the machine was checked by a specialized technician from the distributor, the failure reason was a failed valve that leaked most of the gas out, the machine kept working with no gas inside for several days, till the point the compressor failed.

the story is long, but I see that the distributor is manipulating us, as a consequence of several complaints of failed and very late service times filed by us to the mother company.which might clarify to you the reason of the overpriced equipment, the distributor told us we might find the same compressor in the market (he gave us the compressor specs), and sent us the 3000$ bill for a new compressor.

so the machine was checked officially, the reason of the failure was identified, and the company provided us with their spare part....

I understand your point of hard choice due to insufficient info, which is why I provided the machine manual and specs...I'm only asking for a logical guess...based on what I said so far (I would also understand if you didn't provide that either).

[ruga]

Hi Expert87

If I am not mistaken, your original compressor TFH4525Z operating envelope is -10°c - +15°c suction.
However your other 2 options, TFH 2480Z and TFH2511Z operating envelope is -30°c - -10°c suction

As you can see its advisable to use the original compressor

[The Viking]

It is not an issue of getting a fit person to work on the job (I can get someone expert to do it)....I just need a confirmed opinion regarding compressor choice.


There are no other jobs included, just bringing the compressor from the mother company and installing it.
I have a technician who can do the job, but he doesn't know specs and details.(basic welding).
////////
do any of the local candidate qualify?
is there any trusted website to get the compressor from?

Now, if you have an expert at hand to do the job then ask for his advice and follow it. He will be able to look at all the parts of the circuit and make an selection accordingly.

But be aware, replacing the compressor is not like replacing a water pump or an electrical motor. When it comes to refrigeration circuits replacing the compressor is not even half the process of getting the system back up and running. Unless you got the right knowledge combined with the right tools it is likely that the system will fail again within a short period of time (if it will start at all).
For example, the oil in your compressor is hygroscopic, it will absorb moisture and become acidic as soon as it is exposed to the atmosphere. If you don't follow correct procedures to remove the moisture and get rid of the acidity the varnish on the windings will dissolve.

And let's face it, a person with the required knowledge of doing the work will also be able to select the compressor...

You been quoted 3000$ for the complete repair of which 1000$ is the cost for the compressor, add to this ~500$ for refrigerant and other bits needed. This leaves 1500$ for the labour.

But there is also another way to look at it...
Those 1500$ also buys you a peace of mind...
Say that you pay the 1500$ for the material, then you will have to pay your "expert".
What happens if (when) this new compressor fails? Who will pay for the next compressor? Another $1500 from where?

Which ever way you decide to go, good luck and god bless..

:cool:

.

[Scramjetman]

Eloquent and succint. Nice one Senor Viking

[r.bartlett]

The guy's an idiot. I told him not once but twice he needed the original compressor but thicko went off on a tangent trying to be all clever but just ended up confusing himself (which wasn't difficult obviously). He needs a slap pure and simple but don't worry he won't be back...

[Luke.G]

I understand your point completely, the machine was checked by a specialized technician from the distributor, the failure reason was a failed valve that leaked most of the gas out, the machine kept working with no gas inside for several days, till the point the compressor failed.

Lol, might want to test the oil aswell while your at it....
get a professional company to come in and replace it and stop trying to cut corners on price, if it is expensive look at a new compressed air dryer unit instead.