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mattym
26-10-2011, 08:40 PM
hi all when i sat my 2079 Fgas cat1 i was told that if a system was short of gas then it was ok to use the pressure that was within the system to find a leak, but obviously re test the system within a month is this proper crack or have i just been fed a load of bull!!!!!!!!!!!:confused:
Any sort os guidence would be greatly appreciated as every body at my company was told the same
Thanks in advance

Grizzly
26-10-2011, 10:30 PM
I don't understand your Dilemma Matt.
Short of reclaiming the remaining charge then pressurizing with Nitrogen. Which may well be what you end up doing if you fail to find the leak.
How do you propose to increase the system pressure to assist finding the actual leak?
If the system is leaking then you need to find the leak.
Until you do you are not supposed to add any more refrigerant.
However I believe there may be circumstances where you can "top a System up!"

The old reasonably Practicable rule applies. But action to repair must follow swiftly.

I am sure the more knowledgeable will clarify this a bit more.

So no you are not being advised wrongly.

You as the actual engineer in attendance are the one liable.
So you are quite correct in wanting to clarify the situation.
I hope this helps.
Grizzly

james10
26-10-2011, 10:36 PM
My understanding is you try to locate the leak and reapir if possible to minimise gas loss then recover and pressure test to the correct pressure and recharge system then carry out a follow up test within
30 days which can be done on the same day provided that the second test is shown as a separate entry on your paperwork

monkey spanners
26-10-2011, 10:51 PM
This is my understanding of it, I don't think there is a set pressure for leak testing, its up to the engineer carrying out the work to decide what pressure to use on any specific system.
This is different to strength testing of new installations which need to be tested to 1.1 to 1.3 times max working pressure or to the highest pressure the weakest component can withstand depending on which is lowest.

So you could you the pressure existing in the system to leak check if its high enough to show a leak, or if not its reco, and ofn time!

I guess there could be a question of how much new pipe put in to repair a section etc would be regarded as a new system as far as the safety pressure testing regs are concerned.

This sort of thing should have been sorted out by the F-Gas peeps and all the engineers given a code of practice, just like mot testers have a list of what and how to test cars etc and whats a pass or fail etc.

Quality
27-10-2011, 07:21 AM
My understanding is you try to locate the leak and reapir if possible to minimise gas loss then recover and pressure test to the correct pressure and recharge system then carry out a follow up test within
30 days which can be done on the same day provided that the second test is shown as a separate entry on your paperwork
That is the correct method

With reference to new pipe, any new brazing has to be pt to verify it's strength etc.

Above all else minimising emissions , ensure correct charge and efficient operation and of course the mountain of records and logs

Tony
27-10-2011, 08:29 AM
Hi monkey spanners,


This is different to strength testing of new installations which need to be tested to 1.1 to 1.3 times max working pressure or to the highest pressure the weakest component can withstand depending on which is lowest.

Since the new British Standard came out the maximum value for strength testing went up to 1.43 AP.

Grizzly
27-10-2011, 09:26 AM
Tony,
What new British Standard?
I thought we were all working to EN378 (2008?)
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks Grizzly.

taz24
27-10-2011, 12:44 PM
Tony,
What new British Standard?
I thought we were all working to EN378 (2008?)
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks Grizzly.

We are mate but were on version 2 now so a few things have changed.

C&G and CITB still work (for the moment) to upto 1.3 but the standards have changed to 1.43.

All the best

taz

.

Quality
27-10-2011, 04:52 PM
Slight correction there taz my friend, CITB, Now as you know is construction skills has always been 1.43 as under J11 as per BS EN 378-2008

Tony
27-10-2011, 05:37 PM
Hi Grizzly,

as Taz and Quality have pointed out, the 'new' British Standard BSEN 378 (2008) has been 1.43 AP since it came out.

So we should all have been working to that for the last 3 years.

taz24
27-10-2011, 05:42 PM
Slight correction there taz my friend, CITB, Now as you know is construction skills has always been 1.43 as under J11 as per BS EN 378-2008

There I go again jumping in before engaging brain :)

Cheers Qual..

All the best

taz

.

Grizzly
27-10-2011, 07:00 PM
Thanks Guys!
For a minute there I thought I had not got the correct set of regs.
It was the BS term that threw me.

Thanks all.
Grizzly

mattym
28-10-2011, 08:06 PM
cheers for that guys wasn't too sure on what or who to beleive

Grizzly
28-10-2011, 11:00 PM
Glad to see you got clarification also Matt.
As it was not my intension to take over your post, I was just after some answers myself!
Cheers Grizzly