Short Filling of New Refrigerant Bottles

[Brian_UK]

Does anyone else suffer from being short changed on refrigerant by the bottle fillers?

Two of the last cylinders that I bought from Climate Center, who use A-Gas, were sold as containing 11kgs of R410a.

However, when weighed before use I found that one contained about 9kgs and the other 8.6kgs.

Obviously CC sell on the A-Gas product without checking the bottles but considering the price of refrigerant now is it not time to start writing to your supplier to stop what amounts basically to theft.

[Grizzly]

I agree, have had more than a few in the past and let it slide.
Now that you mention it Brian.
I may raise the issue next time.
Grizzly

[james10]

Never noticed on new cyliders, but have noticed the dip tubes in receiver cylinders are cut short quite often, which is a pain on large bottles

[chillerman2006]

Hi Brian

have never had it that far out, but have noticed most of the time it ranges from 10.5-11.5 & has normally evened itself out

if we all start complaining and where time is available either check bottles when collected/delivered and back the ones that are low...it should not take long to rectify itself

will inform everyone I know in trade today

R's chillerman

[simon@parker]

have always checked bottle weight its best to wheealed as well as theres no way you can prove it and i do believe it leaks out its not short weight its lost gas but who leak tests there bottles ? or even checks them for leaks when they come

[Brian_UK]

Good point Simon, I'll have to start checking that.

I have told CC that we will be writing to them about it, what happens is another matter.

But when you consider our legal responsibilities (let's not start off on this one yet) how do you 'account' for that one kilo of gas that wasn't there in the first place?

Also how can you charge your client for 11 kgs of gas when you've only put 8.5?:eek:

[al]

Why don't you weigh the bottles at purchase? Not beyond the wholesalers to hook up scales, seeing as how they have to make up the shortfall to you.

al

[chillerman2006]

Why don't you weigh the bottles at purchase? Not beyond the wholesalers to hook up scales, seeing as how they have to make up the shortfall to you.

al

Good point Al

for most buying across counter anyway

my refrigerant is delivered to site & first I see of it could be days after delivery

And I do not have the means of transporting a number of bottles back to supplier

This is something that needs rectifieing at source, the manufacturers

as they now have an obligation under f-gas (I think - is that correct ???)

R's chillerman

[monkey spanners]

Had a R22 bottle that was 200g short the other day, i keep the caps on them when not using them so wonder if it was a short fill rather than leakage in storage.

The other thing i notice is the tare weight doesn't always tally with whats stamped on the bottle....

I will be paying more attention to this in future.

On a similar theme, have had acetylene and oxygen bottles that have been only half pressure on first use too, and at the prices boc charge i think i will be making more of a fuss over this to rather than just letting things go.

[mikeref]

have always checked bottle weight its best to wheealed as well as theres no way you can prove it and i do believe it leaks out its not short weight its lost gas but who leak tests there bottles ? or even checks them for leaks when they comeSimon, just so you know, it is law here in Australia to check all refrigerant bottles on a regular basis for leaks. Has to be written down and kept on file for audit purposes. The list goes on but haven't found A-Gas to short change me.. yet. Always check new oxy/acet bottles as one i picked up was 1/2 empty:eek:.

[AUScooler:-)]

I check the net refrigerant amount every pick up and have found the odd one short of gas. In Australia my employer uses the refrigernt records required by the ARC every 3 months along with purchase order records and job sheets to moniture how much refrigerant I have purchased and how much I have billed to the customer. If I get a bottle short a couple KG it will show up missing in the records and will result in an arguement with my employer.

[r.bartlett]

I have mentioned this several times over the last few years.This being only recently:

http://www.refrigeration-engineer.com/forums/showthread.php?33048-taking-spigots-off-daikin-cassettes&p=241049#post241049

Also pipe and cable manufacturers short changing..It's common in manufacturing...

[chillerman2006]

I have mentioned this several times over the last few years.This being only recently:

http://www.refrigeration-engineer.com/forums/showthread.php?33048-taking-spigots-off-daikin-cassettes&p=241049#post241049

Also pipe and cable manufacturers short changing..It's common in manufacturing...
Just Viewed, hmmm see this been happening for some time then
EVERYONE has to complain & return goods....only way to get it sorted
bet they just palm it off to someone else though
to much agro to return to manufacturers

R's chillerman

[simon@parker]

way to make sure yr audit always stands up is every gas bottle gets its own piece of paper that stays with it you write on it date you got bottle and the recieved weight you write on every unit you use it on and how much you put in if you use it all on only one unit you still do the piece of paper when bottle empty you weigh it write that on paper and return it a full auditable system oh also put bottle serial number on it as well can be used for reclaim cylinders as well also handy cos u instantly know how much gas you got in bottle or space to relaim to i implimented this at my current employers it works an it works well we have a full trail from birth to return for every single bottle of gas with its serial no on and the mod serial no of unit and site unit on fully Fgas compliant also you know when a bottle comes and its short of gas still sealed :)

[thebigcheese]

a gas bottles are bad for leaking, ive had a few returned due to this