Liebert Hiross Manual - help sought

[weirdscenes]

Hi peeps
I am about to start re-assembling the re-commisioning a Liebert Hiross unit that was stripped by others some months ago.
As far as I can discover it had a leaking evap coil and some sort of controller problem.
Yesterday we received a new coil, plus controller, harness and a couple of small PCBs assosciated with controller but there is no manual available.
Model number is 4PCA1ABBH84PX$2B6430
Serial # 22981 30001
Year Sept 2001
ANY help would be greatly appreciated

Thanks in hope

[Brian_UK]

Found this for a start...
http://webmanuals.lennoxeurope.com/Out%20of%20Production/Close%20Control%20Units/Liebert%20Hiross/Hiflex/Hiflex%20Productdocumentatie_eng.pdf

Insatllation? in Dutch...
http://webmanuals.lennoxeurope.com/Out%20of%20Production/Close%20Control%20Units/Liebert%20Hiross/Hiflex/Hiflex%20Service_Manual_Ned.pdf

Or you might like to look around their site for more...
http://webmanuals.lennoxeurope.com/Out%20of%20Production/Close%20Control%20Units/Liebert%20Hiross/Controls/

[weirdscenes]

Thanks for this Brian - this is of some use but today I had a good look and it seems that my predecessor decided the controller needed replacing and I am faced with fitting the new controller which is quite radically different from the original Hiromatic. He left no notes.
I will have a good look at the supplied parts tomorrow and at the 3 CD's that came with the controller, PCB's, new wiring harness etc - there is no paperwork.
I really need a circuit diagram - maybe it's on one of the discs !
More details will follow
Tony

[weirdscenes]

Hi folks
Back to this Liebert Hiross
The A/C unit is a Hiflex model 4CA1PABBH84PX
Serial# 2298130001
Year 2001
It used a Hiromatic G controller which has been damaged

Parts were ordered from Emerson who we understand have taken over Liebert Hiross.
Emerson controller has been supplied with 2 sub PC boards and various wiring
mechanical parts were a new evap coil
we received 3 cds but no printed matter CD 1 has lots of info on the new controller but no wiring diagram and the other 2 CD's look like firmware.
At a guess the supplied controller can be used in a variety of different syatems and I would guess the some of the wiring is not needed.
We have been in contact with Emerson but so far not got much sense from them If I could get a circuit diagram of the old Liebert Hiross unit showing contactors etc and the interfacre to the Hiromatic controller I can work it out.
Once again ANY help would be greatly appreciated
Regards
Tony

[NoNickName]

Very brave of you trying to reassemble a puzzle with no reference documents.

[devlin maguire]

http://holod-konsultant.ru/yabbfiles/Attachments/hiromatic.pdf

Try here it.s huge pdf

[devlin maguire]

Or this one for the G
http://webmanuals.lennoxeurope.com/Out%20of%20Production/Close%20Control%20Units/Liebert%20Hiross/Controls/ENG_CCAC_Evolution_Manual.PDF

[weirdscenes]

Hi again folks
Thanks for all your replies - it keeps hope alive !
I have to get this going - and contractually we have to use approved parts - hence the expensive emerson route.
First - don't have part numbers my predecessor ordered the parts and they arrived at our office - whereas I am site based.
Second - thanks for the links -
The first link manual I already have
The second fot the hiromatic G has elec connection drawings from page 74 to 78 which might be useful but all the legends are in gibberish.

I have at least 5 versions of the emerson replacement controller manuals as pdf files - but I think the suppliers have just used a shotgun approach and sent lots - hoping I would find what I need,
My super has been constantly on the phone to emersons UK and today they admitted all the tech people are in Italy and none speak english. They say they are working on it !


The Emerson panel mount HMI (replacing microface G) has several network type connectors which are to be linked to 2 small emerson PCB's which mount externally These replace the boards within the hiromatic G. One of the sub boards has a number of push-on plugs which are different from those on the back of the hiromatic. these plugs connect to the various bits listed below via a terminal strip within the main panel
The new transformer is 24 volt only whereas the old was 24V and 10V

In simple terms - I need to know the following
how to connect these plugs to the follwing items
Faan contactor coil
compressor contactor coil
heaters contactor coils x 2
humidifier contactor coil
HP cutout
LP cutout
Hum drain sol
Hum fill sol
Liquid line SV
crankcase heater
possibly a couple of other items like airflow switch and bead sensor ?
overrheat stat (for elec heaters)

There is a hum/temp sensor which I think connects via network cables (CAN?) and the boards and controller HMI connect also through network cables - this bit is straight forward

Today I stripped out all the wiring associated with the old plugs from the back of the hiromatic G then traced out all the remaining wiring from/to the terminal strip and identified the various contactors.
I have figured out some things using the very limited connection drawings in the emerson contrller manual but am confused by some of the items shown theron eg the solenoid valves do not tally with what I have.

I am an old geezer and have been doing this sort of stuff for a lot of years - WHY the hell is there no circuit diagram for the electrical circuit but tons of unusefull stuff on the controller ???
Even when I get all this hooked together I do not know if the supplied parts have the correct eprom/firmware etc and the instructions I have are somewhat generic and not specific.

end og rant and living in hope

[weirdscenes]

Both those boards are supplied in a housing and are linked together I am fairly sure the HCB is for hum control as it has a current transformer thru which one of the hum element leads will be routrd.
So I am viewing this pair as a single board. The other board is about the same overall size as the linked boards together and has all the male pins P1, P2, P3 etc. These boards appear to be the replacements for the PCB within the back of the Hiromatic G controller.
I have been assuming that these boards are intended to be mounted separately from the new emerson (Microface E ?) controller - but it just occured to me that maybe they are intended to fit onto the back of the HMI ?
Both these were supplied with plastic housings which look like the pcb's should be clipped onto them, BUT the housings themselves do not have any obvious holes or fixings so maybe they just clip on the back of the HMI ? (seems unlikely as this would make the emerson controller much deeper than the old hiromatic, It is already significantly larger than the hiromatic G and I will have to cut out the front panel to make it fit,
By the way - the Hiflex is a single compressor, single fan unit,

[weirdscenes]

Narkom
That's the board - if you can help with wiring diagram to install this in Liebert hiross Hiflex I would be very greatful
Regards

Tony

[weirdscenes]

Narkom -

Thank You VERY much
I have had a quick look at several of the files and it looks like this is what I have been seeking.
I will print them out at work tomorrow.
At a guess I would say you are reasonably familiar with these Liebert hiross units ?
Is the HPM unit the same as the Hiflex - Model 4CA1PABBH84PX
Serial# 2298130001 (Year 2001) ?

[vwsplitty]

By the way all Icom boards and Icom displays are shipped without software on them unless you have asked for it to be put on.So if you dont have software already on them you either need to send it back to get it put on or get an Emerson engineer to come to site.

[weirdscenes]

Thanks again for the help recived to date.
Narkom - the circ. diagrams were what I was after.
We finally received circuit diagrams for the newer configuration from someone at Emerson. With the old and the new drawings I was able to figure it out and wired everything up.
Then I powered up and did a few checks BUT -- - we do not have a password to access the emerson controller in order to set up the running params.
I was away for a couple of weeks and left it to our supervisor to try and get a password from the emerson people. He has been given a code - 501 - which does not appear to work
On the screen it is asking for a 4 character password and has 6 levels of access.

VWSPLITTY - appreciate your comment but we can barely get any feedback from Emerson - let alone get an engineer to site.
When this job was first tackled it was by other engineers with limited knowledge.
The old hiromatic G controller was possible damaged during dismantling to remove the leaking evap coil - this sparked of the long saga and I guess at the time (I was not employed here then) everyone thought it would be a simple matter of getting another similar controller.
We have spent well over £4K on parts and when the stuff was ordered it was understood that all the necessary stuff - together with instructions would be supplied.
This should NOT BE such a difficult job !
If I had been involved from the start I would have probably bought a vastly cheaper generic controller and fitted that.
However this is an M.O.D contract and we have to work within some tight constraints and limited budget.
A requirement is to replace like-with-like as far as parts go.

One other as-yet-unknown is that the original airflow sensor is a 3 wire PTC and the newer drawings show a 2 wire NTC. (I may have written that the wrong way round) As previously mentioned I have at least 8 manuals of various types in PDF format that were supplied on CD by emersons and there is reference to being able to use the 3 wire sensor on the newer emerson controler - but it will need to be configured in software and before that I need to be able to access the menu's

Finally, Emersons supplied an additional remotes board in a small houding which has menu buttons and a small LCD.
I assume this is intended to be mounted remote from the Hiflex unit and connected by CAN bus. This is not needed though so I have not installed it.

Once again - Thanks for help to date and any furthe info would be greatly appreciated

Tony

[weirdscenes]

Sorry forgot to mention Emersons part number for the controller kit was 454305

Tony

[weirdscenes]

UPDATE
This unit is now fixed ! (well almost)
See posts in related thread
regards
Tony

[Tiesse]

duplicate post!

[Tiesse]

Finally, Emersons supplied an additional remotes board in a small houding which has menu buttons and a small LCD.
I assume this is intended to be mounted remote from the Hiflex unit and connected by CAN bus. This is not needed though so I have not installed it.

Once again - Thanks for help to date and any furthe info would be greatly appreciated

Tony

Without the 3 digit display, you may find that the unit runs continuously.

[Tiesse]

My super has been constantly on the phone to emersons UK and today they admitted all the tech people are in Italy and none speak english. They say they are working on it !



Not true I'm afraid. There is local UK tech support & Italy would only get involved if the local team were unable to resolve the issue.

Even if you had to speak with Italy direct, they all speak very good English.

I know all of this 1st hand.

01628 403200

[weirdscenes]

Thanks Tiesse
We did eventually get contact with the UK emersons people and evantually a very capable emerson engineer called John Wilson.
He came to site and loaded correct firmware and identified a couple of wiring errors I;d made and we got the unit up and running.
Had teething problems in that we couldn't get any proper dehum - resolved by enabling electri reheat
regards
Tony