Hi All! New member with F-Gas queries!

[F-Gas2011]

Hi everyone,

Been reading on here for a little bit and thought it's best to register and ask a question as I haven't been able to see what I am looking for.

Firstly, sorry if this is in the wrong place but I couldn't really work out which section it would be best suited to.

I currently work for a plumbing and electrical firm down in cornwall and we work for a various large housebuilders. More and more are specifying ASHP and the problem we have is that there are few people locally who supply / fit the specific model specified by the builders.

I am just finishing college for plumbing nvq2, but have had a fair bit of experience with my dad, uncle, brother etc all plumbers.

My boss is obviously keen on getting into renewables and therefore wants to send me on the BPEC course for GSHP/ASHP. Now, the issue lies with the fact that the manufacturer we use is seemingly the only one who requires that installers have F-Gas certs, whereas the other manufacturers will let someone with the BPEC fit it and then they will come out to charge the system and comission it.


I've looked into the J11 F-Gas cert locally and boss is willing to put me through it, however the training centre say that plumbers don't do well on it, and candidates need a refrigeration background, despite the official City and Guilds blurb saying that the course is suitable for new entrants.


I need to know how much of a challenge this f-gas cert would be, as a straight up newcomer on the theory side of things? I've got half a brain, so hopefully it'd just be a case of major book reading sessions?

The course is a 5 day jobby. I have no intention of getting into full on aircon or refrigeration etc, just enough to allow me to install this particular brand of ASHP - and make me indespensible to the company :)


Sorry for the long ramble on guys.

Hope to hear from one of you soon! Thanks

[NoNickName]

I don't see why manufacturers should mind whether their customers are certified or not. In fact, we are selling from Italy to the UK to anyone willing to buy.
But anyway, judging from the way you write and make yourself understood to non-english speakers like me, I think your results will be no less than brilliant.
Go ahead and good luck.

[stufus]

Maybe it's just me ,but i've yet to come across a GSHP/ASHP that doesn't come pre charged.
Every sod and his dog are throwing them in over here.
Granted the commissioning and selection are a different kettle of fish.
There are a few members who believe the fridge game should be a closed shop.
But if your confident and competent why not.
I know plenty of plumbers and sparkies who are decent fridgemen ,without any formal training who are now f-gas certified .
My personal belief is if you're willing to go about it the right way and follow the rules , Go ahead
The f-gas course is not that difficult a bit of reading and pay attention at the course and youre good to go
Cheers
Stu

[Grizzly]

F-Gas 2011.
Good Luck your aspirations are commendable.
From my personal experience it will depend upon who is doing the training.

The original F gas or so I thought was to get everyone in the A/C industry up to the same starting point.
Sold as a minimum requirement training.
It will also a be Legal requirement in a few months time.
Are you going to become Gas safe?
If so then you should understand that it's the same for Refrigeration Engineers and F gas!

Whereas I thought Heat pumps (Air to Water) were going to be freely available as they are self contained refrigerant wise?
With just a supply and 2x 22mm connections to connect.
I thought that these sealed systems were being freely sold to Plumbers.
With the exception of Daikin Altherma systems. Who require attendance of a specific course?

However what appears to be the case Daikin excepted. Is that the Utility Companies have cornered the market.
And it is difficult to get hold of the system of my choice anyway. Because the manufacturer would rather sell block sales to the likes of EDF.
So even if you have trade accounts and qualifications coming out your ears.
They ain't being supplied.
Not in our neck of the woods anyway.

2 separate issues I think?
Grizzly

[Brian_UK]

I agree with previous comments and would add that the J11 is a CITB course as against a C&G one.

Would I be correct in thinking that you are looking at a Liskeard based training centre? If so then you shouldn't have any major problems.

When I did my course there were a few people who had some 'gas' experience as they worked on domestic fridges etc. However they had no real experience of the operation of a refrigeration system. They passed because people worked as a team and helped one another along. Also, J11 is open book and the trainers are there to teach, remember it's your money that is paying, so get them to do their job.

Good luck with your endeavours and welcome to the forum.

[charlie patt]

someof the ashp/gsp and water to air are a hermetically sealed unit you run the water pipes to them no f gas required that why the non trained have no problem fitting them but some models even the water to air still run refrigerant pipes to indoor exchanger and this requires the f gas as you know if your willing to have a go why not are you doing your training in liskeard?

[Brian_UK]

Quite a few SWAATers around then. :D

[F-Gas2011]

Hi, thanks for all your replies.


Yes! The illustrious SWAAT would be the place I am considering ;). I know one of the guys down there and our firm use them a fair bit.


It is indeed the Daikin Altherma units which I am referring to. Following my conversations with Daikin, before they would even contemplate letting us buy the Altherma units, they would want the following:

Be NICEIC registered for MCS on electrics.
Have WRAS.
Have done a MCS accredited ASHP course...which I am yet to find out if the BPEC one is.
Complete the F-Gas course. (Needed as the Altherma system we fit is split - if it was monobloc then there would be no need for F-Gas as I'm sure you are aware!)
Attend 2 days training at Daikin in Bristol, or their affiliate college in Bath.

Nice!


And yes, I do intend on doing regular Gas quals when I get the chance!

Guess I'll have to have a bit more of a think in depth as to costings and viability with regards to profits etc :confused:


Thanks for your assistance guys!

[Brian_UK]

Oh, life is such a joy, isn't it? :D