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Krups
11-07-2005, 07:17 PM
this is for all the people out there trying to get their foot in the door,
basically how i started was i done the f/t nvq 2 plus the tech certs, last year, at basford hall..
managed to get work exp with a local comp thanks to mel's contacts,(it DOES help if you know someone, who knows someone[or two])
otherwise i found it EXTREMELY difficult even to get non paid wrk exp, so difficult i didnt get any even after i finished coll.
i found that people dont want to take on non paid work exp students probably due to liability reasons, or whatever(best to ask them)
so i started to apply for jobs, as a trainee/apprentice.
took me 3 months as EVERYONE wants exp...and i found most trainee spots get filled by ppl that have the contacts to the companies i.e family or friends.

then one day on starting my rounds through the yellow pages again for the 100th time, the 2nd comp i called asked me to go in for a chat(studied the company before i went and done some revision in that field before i went ie air conditioning so could answer all the questions they asked :D and also took in my portfolio of work, which helped ALOT).
as luck would have it they are only based round the corner, and were willing to give me a chance, couldnt pay a proper engineers rate as i didnt have enough on site exp, but didnt want to pay me an apprentice rate cos of my age and qualifications. so we came to a deal and iv been here almost a year now, and enjoy most the days, one thing i do miss is the refrigeration side, as this is only an a/c comp, but iv found that theres still so much to learn within this sector of the hvac industry it keeps my brain input to a happy level.
I almost completley gave in to the idea that i wasted a whole year at college, but ironically it was that fact, that probably won me the job as the boss was impressed i got off my own arse to go and do that.
An idea might be, to get your foot in the door first, then start the 2 year p/t course, as i reckon you'd probably benefit more.
but it all depends on ur own personal circumstances, if that doesnt work...
KEEP PESTERING EVERYONE TILL SOMEONE GIVES IN !! :eek:
i did find that you will find very helpfull people on this site that will be willing to help you, even to the extent of offering you work (thanks to those that did(Marc + Richard -FridgeTech, FreezerGeezer) when i asked the same question ppl are still asking now)

hope this helps... :cool:

frank
11-07-2005, 09:22 PM
managed to get work exp with a local comp thanks to mel's contacts,(it DOES help if you know someone, who knows someone[or two])


Hi Krups

Did you get work experience in Nottingham or Leicester?

Krups
11-07-2005, 09:53 PM
leicester, with snow refrigeration, and glenfield air conditioning

frank
12-07-2005, 07:14 PM
Well Mel lives in Leicester so it's not surprising that he has contacts down there.
Doesn't stop him perstering us in Nottingham though :D

benijoseph
12-07-2005, 07:41 PM
[QUOTE=Krups]this is for all the people out there trying to get their foot in the door,


Dear friend,
U where running after JOB , instead of that ,if U
run after work it will be easier! confused !
kind regards,
beni joseph,

:cool: :cool: :cool:

Abe
13-07-2005, 11:10 AM
Im really pleased for you Krupps, just shows that persistence and focus pays off..........

I wish you well in every respect.

I have been working God knows all hours, but as soon as there is a lull we must get together for a chat and gossip..........about 410A and this and that..........

Take care and good to see the ship leaving the ground........

Bon Voyage.......

Abe
13-07-2005, 11:13 AM
[QUOTE=Krups]
Dear friend,
U where running after JOB , instead of that ,if U
run after work it will be easier! confused !



Ah Haaa............We have a philosopher within our midst.........a Guru!!!

I like you, Beni........... :) :)
It takes all sorts...............so keep it rolling!!

Abe

Krups
13-07-2005, 06:33 PM
Well Mel lives in Leicester so it's not surprising that he has contacts down there.
Doesn't stop him perstering us in Nottingham though :D

haha mel has contacts everywhere, and seems to get people the work exp, must be pulling "favours" like that guy in Vengeance Unlimited.... :D

Krups
13-07-2005, 06:38 PM
[QUOTE=Krups]this is for all the people out there trying to get their foot in the door,


Dear friend,
U where running after JOB , instead of that ,if U
run after work it will be easier! confused !
kind regards,
beni joseph,

:cool: :cool: :cool:

if buy that, u mean go and get work myself, then you are correct, it is alot easier, but without any site exp as i mentioned i would have made myself look a fool trying to fit something when i dont correctly know how....
but now i do take on my own work, only when i know i can do it properly...if i get any thats out of my range il pass it on to my boss or find some1 i can work with (nudge nudge Aiyub!)

;)

Abe
13-07-2005, 07:42 PM
Yes of course Krupps................we can work together......

benijoseph
14-07-2005, 06:54 PM
[QUOTE]if buy that----- my boss or find some1 i can work with (nudge nudge Aiyub!)
;)
:cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :coo

Mr, KPS,
When a person finishes his education with full confidence, He will not be afraid of any thing in his field ,
But at the same time if he had not taken is education seriously, He cannot face the world with his limited knowledge, So self confidence is must ! I thing you lack it,
Iam sorry for my comment, If you are through in your field theoreticly, practically it will be very easy to face it!

Regards,
beni joseph,

Peter_1
14-07-2005, 07:54 PM
I told this story already here .
In my younger years - centuries ago :p - I followed theoretical HVACR lessons and ended first. So I had reason to be proud.
But you could also follow practical courses on Sunday which I couldn't follow due to our very young kids at that moment and a working wife on Sunday.
So, I also had to make a practical test and they had a simple setup - something like a hermetic 0.75 Hp condensing unit connected to an air blown evaporator - and they had deliberately made a fault in it. The hole was to find the fault.
I even didn't know how to connect a manifold to the service valves and I didn't know it even was a manifold. Saw then for the first time in my life an expansion valve.

Another one: a colleague of me started his own business after several years spending in a rather big engineering company.
I still remember the following: i saw him blowing and sucking with his mouth in the service hoses while turning on the manifold knobs and looking to the dials. He didn't know the meaning of all those knobs and didn't know what he had to do to connect a dial to the correct hose. He has no 3 to 4 vans and is working with more than 10 peoples.

What I mean telling this: the best theoretical course without the necessary practical experience is almost worth nothing. I'm one of those who's sure you need both in refrigeration: a very good theoretical base and a good 'master' who teaches you everything. Remain sceptic and keep reading the basics, new techniques, Refr. articles, ..
I've seen guys who learned it in the field, only by doing with their own hands an never followed any theoretical courses: they mount a TEV wit orifice 5 instead of a 2 and they turn the SH spindle some turns and are convinced that they're doing it the right way, or they regulate their LP safety pressostat Start 1 bar and DIFF at 2 bar, convinced that the is starting point and 1 the cut-out pressure,...

Krups
14-07-2005, 11:11 PM
[QUOTE=Krups]
:cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :coo

Mr, KPS,
When a person finishes his education with full confidence, He will not be afraid of any thing in his field ,
But at the same time if he had not taken is education seriously, He cannot face the world with his limited knowledge, So self confidence is must ! I thing you lack it,
Iam sorry for my comment, If you are through in your field theoreticly, practically it will be very easy to face it!

Regards,
beni joseph,

beni, i only agree with you on 1 single point in ur comment, and that is, self confidence is a must, which id like to point out i dont lack, and that it is also a must in any career you wish to work in, or anything you do,
also i have finished my education(so far) with confidence on what i have learnt, but if you were not in my 1 year course at basford hall 2003-2004, i strongly wish for you to keep quite on such matters. myself along with ALL my fellow students in that year, were so unhappy with the course, we ALL wrote a complaint to the principle, of which nothing has been done.
i would also like to point out that the 1 year f/t course is noway enough knowledge to start working in the trade as an engineer, let alone on your own in the industry...esp the course i did in that particular year...
which is why i wrote that i would recommend any student wishing to do this course, to get a job first, then do the p/t 2 year course as you would benefit a hell of alot more....

do you believe that out of 18 of us on the course, that only 1 student passed all 3 exams(which were delayed by city and guilds for 1 whole year!!!!) on their 1st attempt, is due to the fact that he took his education "seriously" and the rest fooled about, wasting a year(including those with families, who took a year out of f/t employment to do this course)....or down to the fact that the whole course was so unorganised and almost a complete waste of time that it was reflected upon by the results of such examinations ?

and just one more thing, as i had no site experience whatsoever before starting work with my current firm, apart from 4 weeks work exp with 2 seperate firms a year earlier...how much knowledge would i have to know theoretically to go out and face jobs by myself and complete them correctly 1st time round without errors....it would be nice to find a student who has studied the course down to the hnc/hnd level, with no manual site exp of using tools....to go out there and do work 100% succesfully...i dont think this would exist, i have found i have learnt ALOT more doing the work out there practically than i did in the classroom...or even in the practical workshop at coll, it probably only prepared me for about 10% of what i face..

Abe
15-07-2005, 09:52 AM
I spent a couple years at Basford..........
Most of the time we sat behind desk scribbling.....

like..........today is filters....so you wrote down all the types.......dessicants, alumina..........crappp crapppppp........

And the months and years rolled by.............you wrote a nice exam at the end of it and a shiny City and Guilds was yours!!!

Yes, the price for that piece of paper was enduring all that scribing.....

These days I dont have the time..........in my youth , yes I could attend college........but that culture was not productive for me.


The course prepared me for the rules of the game.........the driving course I had to do myself.......

Thats the difference. The course prepares you for your theory test .........

Does not give you a car, or an instructor, or teach you to drive........

One other element is vital..............Love

My thirst for this business was infectuous........I learnt the business because I loved it.........

There is no better teacher then love..........

Krups
15-07-2005, 07:49 PM
filters? wats one of those ? :confused:

Abe
15-07-2005, 08:03 PM
Are u kidding me???
:)

Krups
15-07-2005, 08:22 PM
do u seriously think we got taught about filters ? :rolleyes:

frank
15-07-2005, 10:03 PM
it would be nice to find a student who has studied the course down to the hnc/hnd level, with no manual site exp of using tools....to go out there and do work 100% succesfully...i dont think this would exist,

To do the HNC course (of which I am one) you need a minimum of Level 3 NVQ or the old fashioned C&G. The HNC is all about design and theory - no practical at all.

If you go about it in another way you don't even need practical skills to get the HNC level. Some on my course worked as project managers or project trainees with no previous knowledge of refrigeration :confused: