water cooled condenser

[philjd26]

hi,

symtoms are

high head pressure @ 23 brg.
discharge temp @ 85c
suction pressure @ 10brg
suction temp high @ 20c
high compressor amps @ 9 ish amps x 3

it is a trane dx water cooled condenser, with a head pressure regulator...checked temps across reg and it is fully open to the condenser bundle, anybody got tips on good confirmation that the hex is insufficent??..overcharged has crossed my mind but discharge temp is higher than normal

rgds phil

[fixit]

Hello
What are the water temp's

FIXIT

[HallsEngineer]

Sounds like shed loads of non-condensibles to me.

[nike123]

hi,

symtoms are

high head pressure @ 23 brg.
discharge temp @ 85c
suction pressure @ 10brg
suction temp high @ 20c
high compressor amps @ 9 ish amps x 3

it is a trane dx water cooled condenser, with a head pressure regulator...checked temps across reg and it is fully open to the condenser bundle, anybody got tips on good confirmation that the hex is insufficent??..overcharged has crossed my mind but discharge temp is higher than normal

rgds phil


Pressure doesn't mean anything without knowing what refrigerant is. If that is R410A then pressures "looks good".:cool:

Also without evaporator air in and out temperatures and condenser water in and out temperatures, nothing meaningful can be said about system problem.
What is "hex"?:confused:

What means "high compressor amps @ 9 ish amps x 3"?:confused:

Please without slang. We are not gang members, we are refrigeration engineers and we need precise language for understanding descriptions of our problems.:eek:

[philjd26]

ok
high load in the room...air on 31c and 26c off with 2 stages of cooling running....

the system operates on r407c
the other stages superheats, subcooling,discharge temp is ok and has a running amps of 7.6 ,7.8 ,7.2...
i am getting a differences of 3 degrees between condenser water in and out on both bundles..

aswell back pressure is 5 brg but superheat is 18c..
subcooling is also low 5c

any more info?

[frank]

ok
high load in the room...air on 31c and 26c off with 2 stages of cooling running....

the system operates on r407c
the other stages superheats, subcooling,discharge temp is ok and has a running amps of 7.6 ,7.8 ,7.2...
i am getting a differences of 3 degrees between condenser water in and out on both bundles..

aswell back pressure is 5 brg but superheat is 18c..
subcooling is also low 5c

any more info?

With a high load in the room, superheat will be high.
Superheat can only be measured and set when the system is near or at design conditions.

[Gary]

Sounds like shed loads of non-condensibles to me.

Yep... sounds like lots of air in the system.

If we knew the water in/out temps that would confirm it.

[philjd26]

temp on condenser inlet was 65 and 45 out...

will reclaim and recharge tomorrow

thanks men

rgrds phil

[Gary]

temp on condenser inlet was 65 and 45 out...



Are you saying the water entering the condenser is 65C?... or is that the water pressures?... or none of the above?

[philjd26]

no, sorry water entering is 28c and 32c out of condenser..
discharge gas entering 65 and 45 out of condenser...

[Gary]

no, sorry water entering is 28c and 32c out of condenser..
discharge gas entering 65 and 45 out of condenser...

The heat is not transferring from the very hot refrigerant to the very cold water. Either the water is bypassing in the end bell of the condenser (less likely) or the condenser is full of air (more likely).

[nike123]

Do you have suction accumulator in your system? With R407C it should be without suction accumulator because of fractionation.
http://www.refrigeration-engineer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=102637&postcount=3

[philjd26]

thanks for reply gary.

the condenser bundle is part of a bigger system consisting of many other condenser cooled by a main plant. also the condensers are located in a lower area to dry cooler, would this air not make its way to the top???

[Gary]

thanks for reply gary.

the condenser bundle is part of a bigger system consisting of many other condenser cooled by a main plant. also the condensers are located in a lower area to dry cooler, would this air not make its way to the top???

It is the refrigerant side of the condenser that is full of air, not the water side.

[philjd26]

It is the refrigerant side of the condenser that is full of air, not the water side.

ok thanks again..

[philjd26]

hi
still have no solved this problem ...however i have further information...

this curcuit has a head pressure regulator, could this be faulty and causing abnormal head pressure/temp and suction head/temp....

the unit is a trane CCU model no. EUEB2208A

any sure test to confirm the regulator??

rgrds phil

[desA]

hi,

symtoms are

high head pressure @ 23 brg.
discharge temp @ 85c
suction pressure @ 10brg
suction temp high @ 20c
high compressor amps @ 9 ish amps x 3

it is a trane dx water cooled condenser, with a head pressure regulator...checked temps across reg and it is fully open to the condenser bundle, anybody got tips on good confirmation that the hex is insufficent??..overcharged has crossed my mind but discharge temp is higher than normal

rgds phil

For r407c, at LP of 10barg=11.01bar(a)
Te,sat=28.2'C (Coolpack)

Something does not stack up with your numbers...

If your LP is fairly high, then I'd imagine your system is over-charged with refrigerant... grossly overcharged.