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View Full Version : Desigining CO2 systems. Where's the literature?







nflood
31-07-2009, 02:38 PM
I am a lifelong Ammonia Refrigeration Engineer and have lots of books and guides on the how-to design systems for NH3, but I am now seeing more CO2 things floating around and wanted to see/read/learn more about how to design these systems. Here in the U.S. the people I've talked to are keeping it pretty much to themselves (understandable as they want to be hired).

Mainly I'm looking for things like pipe sizing and fluid properties as I know how to do heat loads and go to the manufacturers on equipment. I've looked around, but I suppose just not in the right places.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

desA
31-07-2009, 02:52 PM
Would Coolpack perhaps help you?

nflood
31-07-2009, 03:59 PM
I just downloaded CoolPack, and it looks like some really good software, but I didn't see anything for line sizing. It is a big program though and thanks for pointing me to it. I'll hopefully get some use out if it in other areas.

Segei
31-07-2009, 05:06 PM
You can find some information in IIAR(International Institute of Ammonia Refrigeration). However, you should be member of this institute.

nflood
31-07-2009, 08:38 PM
Yeah, I'm in IIAR. They have a number of papers on it, but nothing for the engineering of systems. One thing I did find was a program called Pipe-Flo that we have a license to. It's not cheap, but it does pipe losses/sizing for just about every liquid except lava. Pretty powerful stuff. I was hoping for something along the lines of an excel spreadsheet or a piping chart, but this should do for now.
Thanks,

desA
01-08-2009, 01:35 AM
I just downloaded CoolPack, and it looks like some really good software, but I didn't see anything for line sizing. It is a big program though and thanks for pointing me to it. I'll hopefully get some use out if it in other areas.

There is a section in CoolPack which provides line-size estimates - auxiliary calculations.

US Iceman
05-08-2009, 01:04 AM
What ever happened to old fashioned number crunching for pressure loss? The fluid properties should be in the ASHRAE manuals.

BESC5240
05-08-2009, 08:07 AM
Hi nflood,

For line sizing (and component selection) you can use the DIRcalc 1.18 software:
http://www.danfoss.com/BusinessAreas/RefrigerationAndAirConditioning/Product+Selection+Tools+Details/DIRcalc.htm

General information can be found here:
http://www.danfoss.com/co2

If your looking for industrial refrigeration applications, you can have a look here:
http://www.danfoss.com/BusinessAreas/RefrigerationAndAirConditioning/Refrigerants/CO2+in+Industrial+Refrigeration+Applications.htm

If you're more into supermarket refrigeration, you can have a look here:
http://www.danfoss.com/NR/exeres/C8F0ED3D-C0C8-4E83-9E74-B032418B2C31.htm

Not that I want to push you towards a certain brand :D , but this is good basic and detailed information about CO2, it's behaviour and available components and controls.

nflood
03-09-2009, 02:57 PM
Thanks. I've downloaded the information/program and played with it a bit. Looks like some pretty good stuff. Thanks alot!

rac
22-09-2009, 03:45 PM
The Institute of Refrigeration in the UK has a Code of practice for Carbon dioxide system design - have you tried that. Its not too expensive and you can download it from their shop at ior

The International Institute of Refrigeration in Paris also has books in english on properties of carbon dioxide but you have to order by post.

D.D.KORANNE
23-09-2009, 09:10 AM
R744.Com website also has useful information

sylane
29-01-2010, 11:02 AM
software called micropipe from whiterosesoftware

Harek
10-03-2010, 03:51 PM
Go to the R744.com site and search for NARECO.
This is a online course.
Tegards

GCAP CoolCast
10-11-2010, 07:11 PM
one of my favorites is

fundamental process and design issues in CO2 vapor compression systems (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&sqi=2&ved=0CBMQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fciteseerx.ist.psu.edu%2Fviewdoc%2Fdownload%3Fdoi%3D10.1.1.125.1719%26rep%3Drep1%26t ype%3Dpdf&rct=j&q=fundamental%20process%20and%20design%20issues%20in%20CO2%20vapor%20compre&ei=Z-3aTIfFFMOB8gaP0Zj4CQ&usg=AFQjCNGW3v2QU6xT8gQ3xt8gma1zTeGDvg&sig2=VlYJMQSwaA9L5_kOQkh50A&cad=rja)

NoNickName
10-11-2010, 07:28 PM
Nareco is the top literature for CO2.