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before
28-04-2009, 03:31 PM
Well, I'd like to recover some space in my laboratory... it's pretty large actually but I find my cascades to take too much space: the 3-stager especially, but my big 2-stager is definitely not small actually :rolleyes:

So I'm thinking of building an 'all-in-one' autocascade. I mean to replace my two actual cascades.

The needs

- Covering temperature range within -100 to -130C (+ or - 20C :p: )
- Minimal size
- Flexibility of move

Idea #1

- Refrigerants: R600 / R507 / R1150 / R14
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Compressor #1 13.5cc/rev
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
- R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
- R600 // R507+R1150+R14 HX R600 / R507
- R600 R600 back to compressor #1
- R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
- R507 TEV
- R507 // R1150+R14 HX R507 / R1150
- R507 R507 back to compressor #1
- R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R1150)
- R1150 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l
- R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
or
b) TEV modded for R1150
- R14 Compressor #2 13.4cc/rev on R14 LSP (preceeded by a hand valve)
- R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
- R1150 R1150 back to compressor #1
- R14 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
- R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
- R14 R14 back to compressor #2

This way, at the end of phase separations, the R14 is stuck into is own area of the circuit by closing hand valves. Then a dedicated compressor is used to make it running. Dunno if it can be done... and if it makes sense.

Idea #2

- Refrigerants: R600 / R507 / R1150 / R14
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Compressor #1 13.5cc/rev // Compressor #2 13.4cc/rev
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
- R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
- R600 // R507+R1150+R14 HX R600 / R507
- R600 R600 back to compressors suc side
- R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
- R507 TEV
- R507 // R1150+R14 HX R507 / R1150
- R507 R507 back to compressors suc side
- R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R1150)
- R1150 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l
- R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
or
b) TEV modded for R1150
- R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
- R1150 R1150 back to compressors suc side
- R14 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
- R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
- R14 R14 back to compressors suc side

Here I'm using 2 compressors in // with basically same specs (one LG and one Toshiba), just because I've them and it would be nice to use them actually thx to their 'relativily' limited power consumption / and noise.

Idea #3

- Refrigerants: R600 / R507 / R1150 / R14
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Compressor 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
- R600+R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
- R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
- R600 // R507+R1150+R14 HX R600 / R507
- R600 R600 back to compressor suc side
- R507+R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
- R507 TEV
- R507 // R1150+R14 HX R507 / R1150
- R507 R507 back to compressor suc side
- R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R1150)
- R1150 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l
- R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
or
b) TEV modded for R1150
- R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
- R1150 R1150 back to compressor suc side
- R14 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
- R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
- R14 R14 back to compressor suc side

Basically the same idea as #2, but with a single and more powerful compressor to be chosen among moderately powerful to very powferful with the LG NG407 for instance.

Idea #4

1st STAGE
- Refrigerants: R600 / R507 / R1150
- R600+R507+R1150 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
- R600+R507+R1150 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R600+R507+R1150 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R600+R507+R1150 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
- R600+R507+R1150 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
- R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
- R600 // R507+R1150 HX R600 / R507
- R600 R600 back to compressor suc side
- R507+R1150 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
- R507 TEV
- R507 // R1150 HX R507 / R1150
- R507 R507 back to compressor suc side
- R1150 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l
- R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
or
b) TEV modded for R1150
- R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
- R1150 R1150 back to compressor suc side

2nd STAGE
- Refrigerant: R14
- R14 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
- R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
- R14 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
- R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
- R14 R14 back to compressor suc side

One autocascading stage + a classic single stage.

Idea #5

1st STAGE
- Refrigerants: R600 / R507
- R600+R507 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
- R600+R507 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R600+R507 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R600+R507 Condenser (to be chosen cuz I don't know how much cooling efficiency I need here)
- R600+R507 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R600)
- R600 Captube (very short cuz all I want is condensing R507 at 0 to 10C no matter the ambient temp)
- R600 // R507 HX R600 / R507
- R600 R600 back to compressor suc side
- R507 TEV
- R507 // R1150 HX R507 / R1150
- R507 R507 back to compressor suc side

2nd STAGE
- Refrigerants: R1150 / R14
- R1150+R14 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
- R1150+R14 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R1150+R14 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R507 // R1150+R14 HX R507 / R1150
- R1150+R14 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R1150)
- R1150 Liquid reciever: Alco ~1.5l
- R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a hand valve):
a) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #1
or
b) TEV modded for R1150
- R1150 // R14 HX R1150 / R14
- R1150 R1150 back to compressor suc side
- R14 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV prior to CPU evaporator #2
- R14 R14 back to compressor suc side

Two autocascading stages.

- 70cm/50cm/85cm case (with an intermediate stage): possibly pvc sides, and caoutchouc wheels.

Hope it can be done. :) I'd like to be able to use R1150 or R14 independently.

before
07-05-2009, 11:13 AM
Well maybe I'm going to make it a little bit differently.

Here's my new idea.

Idea #6

1st STAGE
- Refrigerants: R507 / R1150
- R507+R1150 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
- R507+R1150 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R507+R1150 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R507+R1150 Condenser: Luve 5.2Kw
- R507+R1150 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R507)
- R507 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 1.6l w/ rotalock valve
- R507 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a valve -electronic?-):
a) (this way it will restrict access to R507 only, R1150 is believed to be pushed and stuck in a closed part of the system) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV: Fach PZ1 (flared)
--- CPU evaporator #1
--- compressor suc side
or
b) TEV
--- R507 // R1150 HX: 12pl
--- compressor suc side
- R1150 liquid reciever: Alco ~1.4l
- R1150 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a valve -electronic?-):
a) (only if R507 is set to way 'b') 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV: Fach PZ1 (flared)
--- CPU evaporator #1
--- compressor suc side
or
b) (only if R507 is set to way 'b') TEV (to be adapted for R1150)
--- R1150 // R14 HX: 12pl
--- compressor suc side
- R507+R1150 Expansion volume: refrigerant tank 2.5l

2nd STAGE (only if R1150 is set to way 'b')
- Refrigerants: R14 / R50
- R14+R50 Compressor 13.5cc/rev, 16.7cc/rev, 33cc/rev, 36cc/rev or 40.7cc/rev
- R14+R50 Oil separator: ShineYear
- R14+R50 Copper filter drier (10 or 15gr)
- R14 // R50 HX: 12pl
- R14+R50 Gas-liquid separator (extraction of R14)
- R14 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 0.88l
- R14 Two independant ways for expansion (each one commanded by a valve -electronic?-):
a) (this way it will restrict access to R14 only, R50 is believed to be pushed and stuck in a closed part of the system) 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV: Honeywell AEL 1 (brazed)
--- CPU evaporator #2
--- compressor suc side
or
b) TEV (to be adapted for R14)
--- R14 // R50 HX: 12pl
--- compressor suc side
- R50 Liquid reciever: Frigomec 0.88l
- R50 A single way for expansion (only if R14 is set to way 'b'):
--- 2 x 2mm captube + CPEV: Honeywell AEL 1 (brazed)
--- CPU evaporator #2
--- compressor suc side
- R14+R50 Expansion volume: refrigerant tank 2.5l

Is that make sense?

I have quite a large choice of compressors to use; don't really know what power the unit will required. I can just use two beefy LG 40.7cc/rev (25,000btu/h) in order to be confident.

:)