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View Full Version : DIEKIN or DAYKIN it matters not!



Grizzly
10-02-2009, 07:05 PM
Apparently it is now pronounced Diekin.
Must be showing my age.
But then again they used to say Nessells now it is nesslay!
Anyway to whoever has anything to do with Daikin.
Your Technical help system is brilliant!
Particularly some guy called Pete from Bristol.
At least that was the area code I dialled, before I was directed through a myriad of number options.

Anyway as any of you guys that contribute regularly will know.
I don't normally deal with "Girly Gas" (R410a).
Well it comes in Pink Cylinders!
That quote was from a respected Sabroe Technician.
And it has made me smile ever since!

As I now know not entirely true.
Especially as I put a set of gauges on a inverter split, in heat mode.
I know, we are taught all about the higher pressures and safe handling of etc.etc.
But until you actually work with it. You pay lip service to the detail!
It then comes as a shock when the discharge line pressure is 26 bar.
Christ I have many chillers that trip on H.P. at well below that!
Anyway I suppose what I am trying to say is respect to R410A AC guys!
And perhaps I wont be so flippant in future?
Still think Girlie Gas is a good term
From an old Stinky.
Grizzly

Thermatech
10-02-2009, 08:25 PM
Griz

last year went to site visit on VRF system tripping on HP.
Outdoor unit normally has HP target arround 30bar in heat mode.
outdoor unit discharge pressure sensor reading 31 bar on circuit board.

Put gauges on unit & found actual discharge pressure 41 bar :eek:

HP safety cut out on this unit pre set at 41.5 bar
Problem was discharge pressure sensor out of calibration & reading 10 bar too low.
Indoor unit off coil 70 deg C + :eek:

Think about all those cheap little splits that dont have any HP safety cut out switch running on R410a in heat mode :rolleyes: what happens when they get blocked air filters or failed fan motor :(

p_p
10-02-2009, 08:38 PM
The compressor goes into permanent retirement, the replacement comp is an uneconomical repair, you sell them a mitsubishi electric system and everyone is happy. ( I think ):)

Regards

PP

Brian_UK
10-02-2009, 08:39 PM
They start making groaning noises. :)

Grizzly, you really do need the valved or safety hoses when on Girlie Gas, it keeps the fingers warmed ;)

Grizzly
10-02-2009, 09:05 PM
They start making groaning noises. :)

Grizzly, you really do need the valved or safety hoses when on Girlie Gas, it keeps the fingers warmed ;)

Got em! Brian.
Just have not had to test a unit in heat mode before!
I use the kwick connectors (think that's what they are called).
It has always been summer see!
Anyway yes they do save your fingers, getting to old to enjoy freeze burn any more!
Grizzly

paul_h
11-02-2009, 01:45 PM
I've been trying to find quick connect or similar (looking for a wind in depressor) in australia for r410a for two years, no one has them here.
Unless you want to reclaim and reweigh in a new charge, never connect up to a schraeder on heating mode ;)

Brian_UK
11-02-2009, 08:13 PM
If you can't get a quick connect how about using valved hoses, such as...

http://www.airefrig.com.au/Files/Price%20List/2008_April/Sections/301%20-%20302.pdf

paul_h
11-02-2009, 11:49 PM
Because the problem is losing refrigerant while screwing on the hose fitting by depressing the schraeder.
Valved hoses would still depress the schraeder while you screw the hose on, in the same way regular hoses would.
Thanks for looking around for me anyway.

Brian_UK
12-02-2009, 12:14 AM
Yeah, see what you mean.

AcidSlasher
12-02-2009, 12:40 PM
hey paul, not sure exactly where in australia you are from but im in NSW, and actrol sell quick connect adaptors for R410A.

they have only been on the market for a few months though, i remember looking for them a while ago and couldnt get them anywhere, but they do exist now.

cant put a price on them i say!!

paul_h
12-02-2009, 01:42 PM
I might look again. The last time I was seriously chasing them was over 6 months ago before I gave up.
I haven't looked for a while because I don't work on much r410a systems anymore.
Most R410a systems are still under warranty , so I don't look at a lot as I don't do a/c warranty work anymore. But I really did need them every winter for the past 4 years!

eggs
12-02-2009, 02:15 PM
I often wonder why you can't get the connectors like you use on car 134a systems.

These get fixed in position and sealed before you break into the system.:confused:

Eggs

paul_h
12-02-2009, 02:33 PM
That's exactly what I wondered and what I have been trying to find, rather than quick connectors.
Rather than a two piece solution that's prone to leaks like a quick connector, I was trying to find something you could secure to the thread, then wind in the depressor, like some automotive adapters do.

brunstar
15-02-2009, 11:32 PM
Griz

last year went to site visit on VRF system tripping on HP.
Outdoor unit normally has HP target arround 30bar in heat mode.
outdoor unit discharge pressure sensor reading 31 bar on circuit board.

Put gauges on unit & found actual discharge pressure 41 bar :eek:

HP safety cut out on this unit pre set at 41.5 bar
Problem was discharge pressure sensor out of calibration & reading 10 bar too low.
Indoor unit off coil 70 deg C + :eek:

Think about all those cheap little splits that dont have any HP safety cut out switch running on R410a in heat mode :rolleyes: what happens when they get blocked air filters or failed fan motor :(

The control that the split systems have is very intense and reliable control, you were saying that if the filters get blocked, well we should not be relying on the HP to break the circuit if the filters were blocked.
what the small systems will do is work on indoor coil temperature, discharge temperature, condensing temperature and compressor current v's frequency and the compressor will go into drooping mode which is a really low frequency (frequency limiting) before turning off and locking out.

If the fan motor would fail it would also go into lock out mode so there are plenty of safeties in the system to keep it safe.

brunstar
15-02-2009, 11:37 PM
Apparently it is now pronounced Diekin.
Must be showing my age.
But then again they used to say Nessells now it is nesslay!
Anyway to whoever has anything to do with Daikin.
Your Technical help system is brilliant!
Particularly some guy called Pete from Bristol.
At least that was the area code I dialled, before I was directed through a myriad of number options.

Anyway as any of you guys that contribute regularly will know.
I don't normally deal with "Girly Gas" (R410a).
Well it comes in Pink Cylinders!
That quote was from a respected Sabroe Technician.
And it has made me smile ever since!

As I now know not entirely true.
Especially as I put a set of gauges on a inverter split, in heat mode.
I know, we are taught all about the higher pressures and safe handling of etc.etc.
But until you actually work with it. You pay lip service to the detail!
It then comes as a shock when the discharge line pressure is 26 bar.
Christ I have many chillers that trip on H.P. at well below that!
Anyway I suppose what I am trying to say is respect to R410A AC guys!
And perhaps I wont be so flippant in future?
Still think Girlie Gas is a good term
From an old Stinky.
Grizzly


the prenounciation of Daikin, it gets everyone but it is simple really, it has never changed and has always been the same it is just that foreigners can not prenounce japanese words.
It is said (Da-"i" kin), due to the way it is written in japanese.
un necessary but it is always a topic of discussion.

Grizzly
05-07-2009, 03:48 PM
I might look again. The last time I was seriously chasing them was over 6 months ago before I gave up.
I haven't looked for a while because I don't work on much r410a systems anymore.
Most R410a systems are still under warranty , so I don't look at a lot as I don't do a/c warranty work anymore. But I really did need them every winter for the past 4 years!

I Know that AcidSlasher said they are now available.
But when I followed this up I was unable to find a Australian supplier.
Anyway if anyone is interested I have found an American supplier (via the Internet) that will ship worldwide.

paul_h
06-07-2009, 12:55 PM
You talking about wind in styles, or the two piece kwick connect?
I bought a kwick connect a while back from actrol like acidslasher suggested.
It still sucks because of it's design, and also because it only has a 1/4" hose connection. So I have to fit a standard 1/4" hose to my r410a manifold just to use it!
I'm interested in any "wind in slow depressor" style 5/16" fitting, ie automotive style, that allows me to use my actual R410a manifold and hoses.
Super extra special bonus points for whoever comes out with a core remover as well to speed up evac times :D
Though more than likely that function can't be used as manufacturers keep putting the valve facing the ground so a long core removal tool can't be used.
wow, this is a bit of a hijack from day-kin and die-kin ;)

Grizzly
06-07-2009, 05:37 PM
You talking about wind in styles, or the two piece kwick connect?
I bought a kwick connect a while back from actrol like acidslasher suggested.
It still sucks because of it's design, and also because it only has a 1/4" hose connection. So I have to fit a standard 1/4" hose to my r410a manifold just to use it!
I'm interested in any "wind in slow depressor" style 5/16" fitting, ie automotive style, that allows me to use my actual R410a manifold and hoses.
Super extra special bonus points for whoever comes out with a core remover as well to speed up evac times :D
Though more than likely that function can't be used as manufacturers keep putting the valve facing the ground so a long core removal tool can't be used.
wow, this is a bit of a hijack from day-kin and die-kin ;)


Paul the style we use is instant disconnect.
So that there is no uncontrolled release of refrigerant.
Unlike the wind in style that will leak as the schraeder is moved.
It also has the 5/16 flare compatible with 410 hoses.
This was the reason for my post as I noticed that Actol etc. did not offer this model.
I will pm you the site address (it,s on the American ebay site) at just under 41 dollars US. Inclusive of shipping to Oz.

Grizzly

I was trying to be a good boy and not post direct links especially as I have given others grief for doing so in the past.
In my defence only where it is obvious there is personal gain!
This is just a site that I discovered trying to find these fittings online.
Try ....

http://cgi.ebay.com/R410A-R-410A-Imperial-Kwik-Coupler-MADE-IN-THE-USA_W0QQitemZ180372781937QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item29ff0e3b71&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262&_trkparms=%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A30#ebayphotohosting

monkey spanners
06-07-2009, 07:54 PM
SRW has some 5/16 windy in valve core tap things in its new catalogue, also some quick couplers in 5/16 both staight and elbow. They also have a 5/16 core removal tool.

http://www.srwonline.co.uk

nick uk
07-07-2009, 08:19 PM
i bought a 5/16 core remover with ballvalve and take off last week from united refrigeration it was a cps

lowcool
08-07-2009, 01:31 AM
You talking about wind in styles, or the two piece kwick connect?
I bought a kwick connect a while back from actrol like acidslasher suggested.
It still sucks because of it's design, and also because it only has a 1/4" hose connection. So I have to fit a standard 1/4" hose to my r410a manifold just to use it!
I'm interested in any "wind in slow depressor" style 5/16" fitting, ie automotive style, that allows me to use my actual R410a manifold and hoses.
Super extra special bonus points for whoever comes out with a core remover as well to speed up evac times :D
Though more than likely that function can't be used as manufacturers keep putting the valve facing the ground so a long core removal tool can't be used.
wow, this is a bit of a hijack from day-kin and die-kin ;)

gday paul
heatcraft stock a 410 core remover,airefrig have an access valve with core depressor spin in type be good if these blokes are in your area otherwise break out the plastic and make a phone call about $95 exc for the depressor i think.the adelaide mob are a good crowd and no im not looking for a better discount from them.
variant spelling dyke-in :D