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Steve
30-01-2001, 09:41 PM
Hi Mark, what is your interpreation of the new PED that comes into effect soon for eureopean engineers..?

As I understand it all service/installation engineers that do brazing will have to be certified to do so by a third party..?

Any thoughts..?

Steve

jwhytock
30-01-2001, 11:57 PM
i recall a while back at rea bott we had to all braze a joint and have them x-rayed , i believe tesco spec for installations at the time! surely nobody would fail , but i have seen some of dez,s joints in the past, many moons ago, mind you!

WebRam
31-01-2001, 08:48 AM
Originally posted by jwhytock
i recall a while back at rea bott we had to all braze a joint and have them x-rayed , i believe tesco spec for installations at the time! surely nobody would fail , but i have seen some of dez,s joints in the past, many moons ago, mind you!


AND !!

I would like to point out James, that only 2 engineers failed that test ..... and I was NOT one of them hehehehe

Tony
13-02-2001, 09:43 AM
The company I work for have been training people to braze to the standards set by the BRA for several years now. If the new european regulation has it's way all refrigeration engineers will have to be assessed and meet minimum standards. Thats not only for brazing but also: refrigerant handling, electrics, basic refrigeration sceince. We can help in all cases, just drop us an email to crownship.com

[Edited by WebMaster on 13-02-2001 at 05:13 PM]

subzero*psia
08-03-2001, 01:29 AM
I thought Europe was already certifying technicians. The way we hear it in the U.S., we are the ones dragging our feet! We have been certifying techs since 1995 at least. You can't repair or even buy refrigerant here without it. They only tell us what they want us to hear I guess.

zolar1
05-12-2001, 07:44 AM
Ummm...about certification and licensing....it seems that ANYONE can buy refrigerant here in the US WITHOUT a license!

They just walk into the supply house and say they are buying for company 'X' and pay cash for it. Try it sometime...you'll be amazed at how easy it can be.

Or they just buy it from a tech who sells it for a nice profit.

Both of these make me hopping mad too.

I took all my refrigerant certification tests (4 of them), and bought my own equipment.

I think that supply houses and manufacturers should be forced to see a license AND valid ID before they can sell refrigerant to someone, and IMPRISON those who sell to or buy/steal from someone illegally.

Zolar

Dan
05-12-2001, 04:54 PM
In Florida, there was a county that had a stringent journeyman's test that involved fitting pipe together and using several forms of molten metal. Even my best guys grew nervous and one or two of my top guys had to retest. The requirement no longer exists. In retrospect,despite what a pain in the butt it was to have to qualify in order to do business, it seems a shame that the requirement no longer exists.

Dan

Derek
07-12-2001, 03:15 PM
From the UK Health and Safety Execuitve website at www.hse.gov.uk

The Pressure Systems And Transportable Gas Containers Regulations 1989 (PSTGC 89) were revoked by the Pressure Systems Safety Regulations 2000 (PSSR 2000) which came into force on 21st February 2000.

Pressure Equipment Regulations 1999 (PER 99) contain an exclusion whereby PER 99 shall not apply to pressure equipment and assemblies placed on the market on or before 29 May 2002, which comply with any provisions with which they would have been required to comply for them to be placed on the UK market on 29 November 1999.

Compliance with PSTGC 89 therefore remains an option, for the purposes of supply only, until end May 2002. It should be noted that much of the guidance in HSE Document HS(R)30, as summarised below, relates to the use of pressure equipment (operation, maintenance, etc) which is now subject to PSSR 2000 and the guidance in L122.

The objectives of the PSTGC Regulations are to prevent uncontrolled release of stored energy and to prevent scalding from steam. The Regulations apply to gases and liquids that become gases on release to atmosphere, under a pressure of 0.5 barg and systems that contain steam at any pressure.

The Regulations cover:

design, construction, repair and modification;
provision of information and marking;
installation;
safe operating limits;
written scheme of examination;
examination in accordance with the written scheme;
action in case of imminent danger;
operation;
maintenance;
keeping of records;
precautions to prevent pressurisation of certain vessels.

It is worth noting that the guidance for Regulation 15 notes that atmospheric storage tanks or reactor vessels are also covered if they require a vent to atmosphere, as there is a danger that the vent may become obstructed.

See also two HSE Approved Codes of Practice:

Safety of pressure systems (COP37)
Safety of transportable gas containers (COP38)

Appendix 1 lists a number of relevant British Standards, and Appendix 2 provides guidance on the contents of a written scheme of examination.

WSE should be prepared and undertaken by a Competent Person that is Chartered or Incorporated level engineer with minimum 2 years relevant experience.

Magic point is 250 bar.litres (pressure x fluid capacity). So when was the last time you proof tested your system……Scared yet…………

BS EN 378 refers to all the safety points like no taper thread PRV's.
:)

frank
08-12-2001, 08:47 PM
Could we have that again in English please! Lol

Frank

Derek
10-12-2001, 12:47 PM
Yes its a really specific set of regulations that apply to almost every fridge installtion in the UK/Europe. Failure to comply will result in nothing happening until you get caught.

Any specific questions......
:rolleyes:

subzero*psia
12-12-2001, 05:08 AM
Sounds like we have the same system as you! LOL! :rolleyes:

And when they do make examples... it is usually the tech that gets whacked.... and hard! Funny thing is... if you don't have a license or certification... they won't do anything or can't do anything, not sure which but that is how it is. So... from that perspective... why would anyone want to be licensed or certified? They just penalize honest certified tech's that make a mistake. But I have to admit... I have only heard of one instance and the tech cut the line with a hacksaw! :eek: Just alittle bit more than a "diminimus release" I would say! LOL!

wellcold
14-12-2001, 05:22 AM
wow a license to buy refrigerants .brasing proficiency certificates.
coming to the UK soon. no doupt engineers will be paying.